Frogs

[Jmarsh]

Mark would you need to recess that in to the channel a little bit? I would be afraid that with full compression the spring still wouldn't allow clearance for the hooks because the spring still takes up space upon being fully compressed. Maybe this is what you had in mind and I just didn't fully understand. Unfortunately I may not have the chance to build anything any time soon, I have to write a paper and give a presentation over the reconstruction of a decellularized mouse heart in a few weeks, which means not much free time. 

[FrogAddict]

Just a thought here. Why not just allow gravity and the natural magnetic force to reseat the hooks? I can see the spring catching weeds and impeding the weedless nature of the lure. Mark, when you tested the lure did the hooks have a tendency to want to separate from the magnets? I wonder if the simpler option would be to employ stronger magnets if needed? If something is needed to "push" the hooks back in place, why not a small piece of closed foam that wouldn't snag weeds as easily? 

 

Really I just want to be involved somehow in this cool idea!!!!

[mark poulson]

Jmarsh, 

You might be right.  I was thinking of using the weakest spring and  putting it close to the hook's anchor screw for leverage, so the hook could deploy more easily.  I guess I'd face the issue of the spring limiting the action of the hook by making the spring recess deep, and only epoxying the very end into the recess.  It's one of the things that the building process would hopefully solve as it goes.

As for the paper on the reconstruction of a decellularized mouse heart, I'm afraid that's way out of my depth, so you're on your own.  Unless, of course, it's carved from wood or PVC!

 

Frogaddict,

The magnets hold the hook tines in place during the cast and retrieve, but still let the tine deploy easily if bitten.

I have cast it, it works in that regard, but there aren't any weeds right now to see how weedless it actually is, at this point.

Everyone on TU is a part of this lure, since everything I learned about lure making I learned here, from TU members who shared their knowledge with me.

Edited January 19, 2014 by mark poulson

[mark poulson]

I over drilled the seat for the frog hook in the new frog I'm making, so I threaded a rubber skirt collar onto the screw to take up the slack, and I got a bonus.  It acts like a spring, pushing the tines down onto the magnets even more strongly, but not enough to affect how the hook deploys.

I realize that rubber skirt collars are not very durable, but I'm thinking of making a bait with just the rubber and no magnets, to see if that works.  I can always put a new skirt collar on when the old one breaks.

That way, I'll save the weight of the magnets, so I can add rattles.

I'm going to try and put one on my first bait, too.

Edited January 19, 2014 by mark poulson

[FrogAddict]

I posted a pic of the new frog I built to the gallery. The dimensions are the same as a Koppers 65. I'm not sure about the hooks I'm using.They are a bit on the light side. I'm thinking I'll switch to punching hooks so when I set the hook they don't bend. Those are Cabelas brand fat grubs for the legs. I tried worms but they seemed too long. 

 

I did have an epic fail this weekend. I carved a frog out of PVC, installed a frog hook in a recessed channel at the top of the body using a small screw and washer through the hook eye but no matter what I tried weight wise it wouldn't right itself in the water and wanted to go upside down. Since I epoxied over the screw into the frog body and over the top of the hook groove, it's a total lose. The only up side is I did learn what doesn't work! Pic below.

 

Edited January 20, 2014 by FrogAddict

[mark poulson]

The rubber skirt band idea is a pain, because it is too tight a fit over the hook anchor screw, so it is really hard to get on right.

I'm searching for another material, because the idea works.

Edited January 20, 2014 by mark poulson

[FrogAddict]

New frog idea below. One single hook that sets into a mister twister twin tail soft plastic. I’m thinking 1 to 1.5 inches round body that is max 2 inches long for the hard part of the lure. Spring in the back to hold plastic. Popper mouth.

 

Edited January 20, 2014 by FrogAddict

[mark poulson]

That looks like it will work.

I worry that the hook attachment that far from the plastic anchor might cut down on the action of the tail if you're trying for a walk the dog action, but it should be great as straight weedless popper.  

Let us know how it swims.

[FrogAddict]

I'm just looking for a straight weedless popper so we'll see.

[mark poulson]

That looks like it could be the ticket!

[mark poulson]

I posted a pic of the new frog I built to the gallery. The dimensions are the same as a Koppers 65. I'm not sure about the hooks I'm using.They are a bit on the light side. I'm thinking I'll switch to punching hooks so when I set the hook they don't bend. Those are Cabelas brand fat grubs for the legs. I tried worms but they seemed too long. 

 

I did have an epic fail this weekend. I carved a frog out of PVC, installed a frog hook in a recessed channel at the top of the body using a small screw and washer through the hook eye but no matter what I tried weight wise it wouldn't right itself in the water and wanted to go upside down. Since I epoxied over the screw into the frog body and over the top of the hook groove, it's a total lose. The only up side is I did learn what doesn't work! Pic below.

 

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I think your frog rolled is that the hook is on top, so it's top heavy.

One of the reasons I hung the frog hook below my frog is to keep the weight low, and toward the rear.

I just posted two more in the Hard Baits gallery.  They are a little different than the first one.  I tried to keep them more buoyant by making them just a bit bigger that the first one, so there is more PVC for buoyancy.

The black one is the biggest, and I was able to add a side to side rattle and still have it float more horizontal.

Did I tell you it's fun making stuff?  Hahaha

[Jmarsh]

I agree with mark, keep the weight on the bottom side. I am currently trying to work through the same problem. The frog that I posted previous doesn't seem to have a preference towards a side when I drop it into the tub. I am trying to figure out a weight scheme that will help keep it belly down when casted. However I am not sure if me dropping the bait from 3 ft above a tub in different orientations will simulate what is happening when casted. What are your guys' thoughts? Go ahead and add some weight which seems to add some success in the tub, or wait until I throw it out on a pond for real?

 

This is the scheme that I am looking at. I have been using sticky tack to "add weight" where I am wanting it. It will only be about .5g per spot. Surprisingly adding that little bit of weight towards the front helped it flip the correct manner for the most part. I sometimes think that the bait is to wide and keeps it from flipping onto its belly, and wonder if a slimmer body would help keeping the correct orientation. 

[mark poulson]

Jmarsh,

With your double hook fixed, there is a lot of weight above the lure, too, so it makes weighting tricky, especially if you want the frog to float more or less horizontal.  Adding enough weight to keep it belly down may make it less buoyant than you would like, but you didn't say how you want the frog to swim.  

I swung my hook so it is below the bait at rest.  I was trying to make it weedless, and the weight of the hook below the frog helped it to turn upright on the landing.  Happy accident.

The line on the lure will affect how it swims, so, you're right, you do need to water test it.  But you can add some line and test it in a bathtub, too.  Dieter does it all the time.  But only a test at the pond will tell you how it casts and works on the retrieve with a long line as a leader.

[Jmarsh]

Thanks for the response Mark. I tested it in the tub like I said and it still sat how I wanted to with the small amount of weight. Slightly tail down with just the head sticking out. I think I am going to have to try your swinging hook idea for sure. Looks like I see a lot of frogs in my near future. Wish it was spring break so I had access to my workshop, unfortunately here at school all I have are small coping saws, carving knives, and some sand paper. 

[mark poulson]

I feel for you, but not too much.  Hahaha   Enjoy your time in school.

[FrogAddict]

OK, so my latest attempt at a weedless popper frog was another bust. I'm going to go with the free swinging hook on the back from this point forward. If you recall, my last idea had the hook eye sitting below the lure and it just didn't allow enough room for a good hook set. I see the free swinging hook as  the best option. It allows for easier weighting and  when you do get a bass on, the bass won't have enough leverage to come unbuttoned (in theory). 

 

Oh, please check out a new idea below. The orange is a rubber band the blue is the fishing line and the black circles would be pins.So when you pull on the line, the frog legs would extend. The feet would be attached to each other. The orange at the "knees" would be some sort of rubber tubing?? Not sure at this point. Any input would be appreciated!

 

Edited January 24, 2014 by FrogAddict

[kajay920]

I think it's worth a try! Are the legs wood? They would have to be of some rigid material. And the pins what would do the the weight and balance of the lure?

[mark poulson]

I was thinking of surgical tubing, because it is stretchy and flexible, and it doesn't rot.  That's the tubing that comes with trailer hooks.

[FrogAddict]

Exactly what I had in mind Mark, or shrink tubing. Kayjay not sure about the weight w the pins. I think the bottom will have to be a deeper keel with weight low in the water to make sure it wants to turn upright. The legs will be wood dowels to start with. The knees have to "want" to stay straight and the center rubber band will to pull the legs back in. One issue will be the play in the line when you set the hook I think.

[mark poulson]

FrogAddict,

Where and how are you attaching the hook?

[FrogAddict]

I'm thinking the rear of the main body. Since I'll be using twisted eyes to connect all leg parts, I could add a treble to where the rear legs meet as well. If i do that I'll move the treble on the main body forward. I started putting the legs together today and did a rough body. I'm using a wood dowel for the body and legs for the prototype.

[mark poulson]

That's a very intriguing concept.

Lots of "little stuff" to work out, but that's the fun part.

Let us know how it works out.

[FrogAddict]

Well I put the legs together and realized I need to taper the ends to get the needed "swing." So I'll be doing it again. This one may take awhile to figure out.I did finish off some Muskie lures and my first attempt at a glider. Posted pics on the gallery.

Edited January 28, 2014 by FrogAddict

[HAWGFAN]

Here is a balsa wake rat I carved.  If you move the eye to where the ear is, it's a frog.  With the trebles, it wouldn't be weedless, but it looks like some guys are using different hooks.  I'm sure you could even find a way to attach legs.  Soft plastic grubs might work.  I'm sure you could have hooked wires coming out the back to hang them on.

 

 

[FrogAddict]

Hawgfan,

 

Nice looking mouse! That's on my short list of lures to attempt. What kind of action does it have with the bill straight down like that?