TheSilverFox Posted September 29, 2014 Report Share Posted September 29, 2014 In the pics I'm going to add i was trying to copy the green copper shad look. These 2 make my 5th and 6th baits I've painted so if you see something i did that is stupid, please tell me. I thought they turned out decent considering my experience. The question i have... I was trying to spray a transparent copper color over the screen for the gill look and it was so thin it didn't work. I have a handheld little contraption that i hold over the bait, i don't wrap the bait it's just laid on top and sprayed. It appears that isn't going to work. If i were to wrap the bait and spray it then hit it with a dryer, would this allow me to get the gill pattern with he transparent paint or would it just move? I worry about the paint being so thin and then with adding a couple coats it not looking right. Thanks and please don't be scared to hurt my feelings. If you see somewhere i can improve or something i did that was stupid let me know. I'm trying to learn on these pre made baits before i mess up on the balsa baits. I've got a bunch ready but I've been scared I'd screw them up. I know you could just start over but the curves on these baits seem to make them a little easier to learn on... but that's just my thinking. I haven't painted one yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSilverFox Posted September 29, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 29, 2014 Sorry for the angles... i took these with my cell phone instead of camera. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted September 29, 2014 Report Share Posted September 29, 2014 Let me make sure I understand you before I try to answer your question. Are you trying to put a scale pattern on the gill area? Ben 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSilverFox Posted September 29, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 29, 2014 I was trying to go from the gill area to the tail area... like you see on most production baits now days. The paint was so thin i couldn't with one pass. The material i use i lay on top the bait and it has worked with the opaque paints. I was wondering if i wrap the bait and use clips to hold it if i could spray it, hit it with a dryer and then add another coat... or is the transparent paint going to be too thin? I have a wishbone looking contraption i made out of plexiglass that i lay on the lure. In the open area i have the gill netting stretched across. It has worked well with opaque paints on the first 4 i made. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted September 29, 2014 Report Share Posted September 29, 2014 The lures look good. I can see the copper over tones. The only way I know to see if a painting method works is to finish a lure with top coat, and see how it looks in the water. Water amplifies and intensifies the colors a lot. I suspend my lures on a foam backing, and drape my scale cloth over them. I use push pins to hold the cloth close while I do as many thin layers as I want, heat setting each layer/color with my hair dryer before I shoot the next. Thin coats are important, so the cloth doesn't stick to the lure, and drying each well is key. But there is really no substitute for actually finishing a lure and seeing how it looks in the water. I think you may be pleasantly surprised when the lure hits the water. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted September 29, 2014 Report Share Posted September 29, 2014 When I'm spraying a scale pattern I wrap the bait with the netting from top to bottom with the ends of the netting ending up at the bottom of the lure. I then place a tongue depressor on each side of the netting and use small binder clips placed on the tongue depressors. That way I can take a clamp off one end and manipulate the netting until it's like I want it. The clamp is placed back on that end of the tongue depressor and the process is repeated on the other end. I like to pull the netting as tight as possible so it fits as snugly against the bait as possible. This will help keep the paint from seeping under the netting. Something else I sometimes do is after I've placed the netting on the bait I will spray a light coat of the same color the netting is covering. This will help seal the netting to the bait and keep your next color from seeping through. Just remember to use light coats because if you spray a ton of paint over the netting it will be just about impossible to get the netting off. Don't ask how I learned that. There are a lot of different ways to do the scale pattern. Some guys use embroidery hoops to hold the netting. Others have holders similar to what you described. Mark's method is another way to do it. The reason I like to clamp the netting to the bait is that I can free up both hands if needed. On a bait like the one you've shown if you wanted to spray the scale pattern on everything but the gill plates I would wrap the lure as explained and clamp the tongue depressors in a pair of hemostats. The hemostats would then be clamped in a hobby vice that I use. By cutting a piece of thin cardboard, or heavy paper, in the shape of the gill plate it could then be held over the gill plate to keep paint from covering it. If you plan on spraying a ton of baits then this process probably wouldn't be the best to use since it consumes more time, but if your a hobby builder like me that only does a few baits at a time then the time factor isn't as big of a deal. Like I said there are a lot of different ways to skin this cat. You just have to find something that is comfortable for you and gets the job done. Ben 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrinityLureCompany Posted September 29, 2014 Report Share Posted September 29, 2014 RayburnGuy couldn't have said it any better. I have used both the hoop and clamping the netting and by far the clamping works best for me. If I want to paint just one area with a different color or achieve a different look I just use stencils I have made. Like Rayburn I only make a few at a time so each one is going to be different anyway and the time to do the netting doesn't really matter. I have left netting on for quite some time and if I dry each coat in between I don't have a problem, but if I don't dry in between well..... Experience no. 3,287! For me the scale pattern is pretty distinct before the clear goes on and is only enhanced by the clear so these lures don't look like they have had enough coats on them, but that is hard to do if you are holding the netting by hand. I think if you clamp the netting and try again you will get the desire you want. Then if not then experience no. 3, 288! Hope that helped. Mike 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSilverFox Posted September 29, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 29, 2014 Man do i feel stupid. Just read what i wrote and it says gill pattern and not scale pattern. I'm sorry guys. I really need more sleep and less work! I'm trying to type, read, and reply while waching my 1 year old... and he is a mess. I can't believe i didn't read over it and catch it sooner. But... I'm thankful you guys have steered me in the right direction even if i don't know what I'm asking. You would think that a lifelong fishermen would know the difference! I'll give it a try when i get to paint again. Between the wife and the son, I have to make my free time count and your info will help me. Pretty good week... the help from you guys plus me learning the hard way last night what an inside of an airbrush looks like. Figured I'd clean it a little better... yeah... went too far and had a spring fall out. Figured i just screwed that one up but i got it back together and it works. Oh yeah... one more thing. I use 2 part epoxy for a top coat. Last night on these 2 lures i added a little denatured alcohol. It thinned it down and i liked the way it went on... but i don't know how much to use. I read somewhere that it was about 10 percent? Is this correct? I figured maybe getting a medicine dropper to just put some in like that. The first couple lures i didn't thin and i wasnt happy with the final product. I got it too thin last night so I'll have to put on another coat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted September 30, 2014 Report Share Posted September 30, 2014 It's hard for me to say exactly how many drops it takes. When mixing enough epoxy to cover one medium size lure I usually add 3 or 4 drops. It may sound crazy, but now I mix it more by feel than how many drops I add. I use a piece of welding rod bent into the shape of a shepherds crook and can tell when the epoxy is thin enough to spread evenly and release the bubbles well. The reason I mentioned the bent welding rod is that I use the same thing to mix the epoxy every time and after mixing epoxy for a few years now I can tell when it's ready by the way it feels. I also use the graduated plastic cups like the ones they bring your pills in when your in the hospital. These are used each time as well. They're only a couple cents apiece from your local pharmacy and can be used many times before they get so full of cured epoxy that you have to throw them away. This is just one more example of coming up with a system to build baits by. When you find a set of steps your comfortable with, and that perform well, keep doing those things and before you know it these things will have become second nature. When you come up on something your not sure about then that's why TU is here. If someone on this site can't answer the question for you I don't know where you can go to get it. good luck, Ben 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSilverFox Posted September 30, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 30, 2014 Thanks. I use the same thing to mix it in. I have been using little wooden sticks to stir it. I've got to come up with a better way of adding it so i think a syringe or medicine dropper will be it. This site has helped me out a lot already just some of the stuff is confusing like the different top coats people use and the different paints. Maybe if i figure out what I'm doing now i can explore other options later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted September 30, 2014 Report Share Posted September 30, 2014 I don't use a percentage amount of denatured alcohol either - I just add a few drops and mix it into the epoxy until I get the thickness I want. JMHO, you don't want the epoxy to be too thin, just a little thinner so it will brush out better and help expel air bubbles. I'm sure it's much less than 10%. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpalinsk Posted September 30, 2014 Report Share Posted September 30, 2014 Three other things I learned from TU when applying epoxy are to 1. Exhale gently over the epoxy after having mixed and before brushing it on the lure as this helps disapates air bubbles. 2. Use an artists brush as it tends to apply the epoxy with fewer bubbles than an acid brush does IMO. 3. Exhale gently over the lure after applying the epoxy which will also help get rid of bubbles that were introduced when applying the epoxy. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted September 30, 2014 Report Share Posted September 30, 2014 Be sure you mix the two parts of the epoxy completely before you thin it. Otherwise, the alcohol will bond to one of the unmixed parts and the epoxy will never set right. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSilverFox Posted September 30, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 30, 2014 That could be the problem. I put the DA in before i mixed. It went on clear and dried clear but tacky... not bad but still tacky. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
