Vodkaman Posted May 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) This is more like what I had in mind; I call it the Hairing - the idea is that it is a collar that will fit over another bait, soft or hard. On a hard bait, it would mimic the gill movement, or legs on a craw. Yes there are other ways of doing this. But the point is, this is a molding exercise to test the method. I think you would agree, that with 50 legs tapering from 0.040" down to 0.025" over 2", might be a problem to pour. Unlikely that the pour would be complete, but we would at the very least learn the boundaries of the method. Making the master will have its challenges too, but I already have that figured out. Dave Edited May 17, 2015 by Vodkaman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRammit Posted May 17, 2015 Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 Nice nice!.. Thats a great demonstration of the method's capabilities, and could be a useful alternative to silicon skirting... But we have different agendas, if i put that much time and effort into a project, it has to catch fish!.... Its great to have you on the other end pushing the limits of what can and cant be done!... TU is lucky to have a Vodkaman on the team!........... But whats with the new profile pic?.. Its cool, but the other one was quite fitting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted May 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 Yes, the other avatar with the manikin kind of summed up what I do. I have been modelling a lot of swimbaits on CAD lately, so I thought I would reflect that in my avatar. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted May 17, 2015 Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 Since i dont belive one exists, i took the liberty of sketching a detailed artist's rendition (ha ha!)..... Likely the body would be thinner, the bulk of the bait would be in its spikes... Obviously many challenges associated with this one, 3 dimentional appendages and possibly hundreds of tiny passages.. ... Way out of my league!!... You are welcome to it if you like Aren't those already produced? I seem to remember something along those lines called a stud fry or something like that. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mohawkman Posted May 17, 2015 Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 http://www.tacklewarehouse.com/Kicker_Fish_Bubble_Fry_4/descpage-KFBF.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted May 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 Mohawkman - Thanks for the link. Yes, this is a molding problem, not the pouring problem that I am looking for. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRammit Posted May 17, 2015 Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) Well it sure is.... Not ecactly like i had in mind though.. Was thinking more of a long, skinny koosh ball... Smaller spikes, and more of em, just didnt wanna draw that many Edited May 17, 2015 by JRammit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRammit Posted May 17, 2015 Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 http://www.sportsmansguide.com/product/index/berkley-powerbait-rib-worm-bait?a=1684263 Vman, heres an example of the ribbed worm i mentioned... Easily done in a 2 piece mold, but seems to offer problems for injectors due to difficulty in venting Another good test would be a mulit cavity, even a simple shape would be uncastable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted May 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 The validity of my tests has to be questioned too, as I don't have access to plastisol. The testing that I did was with e meltable rubber. A lot stronger and stiffer than plastisol. Can't remember the name of it, but I think it would make good baits with the right design, to take into account the less flexible medium. The ribbed bait in the link would be no problem. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNC Molds N Stuff Posted May 17, 2015 Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 Thankyou gents. Other than here on the pages of TU, I have never even seen a plastic bait let alone fished one. So these are unlikely to be used. I did these experiments for TU members. The large vents and huge sprue are only half the story, can anyone work out how it was done before I write the tutorial? I can't see the pictures. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNC Molds N Stuff Posted May 17, 2015 Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 Ah, there they are. If I'ld had a chance I would have probably guess you were using vacuum venting, but only because I have seen you mention it before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted May 17, 2015 Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) Bass Pro Shops made the worm you are wanting JRammit about 20 years ago or so. They made grubs and worms and I think french fries but could be I just ripped the tails off as they were little sickle tails that weren't very sturdy. I probably fished a thousand or so of them one year when I actually fished a lot. I didn't buy any more after that and they were discontinued not many years later. They worked fine but no better than a traditional worm in my view point. In fact liked them less as they tended to get hung up on branches, lotus stems, etc... Edited May 17, 2015 by Travis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted May 17, 2015 Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 Bass Pro Shops made the worm you are wanting JRammit about 20 years ago or so. They made grubs and worms and I think french fries but could be I just ripped the tails off as they were little sickle tails that weren't very sturdy. I probably fished a thousand or so of them one year when I actually fished a lot. I didn't buy any more after that and they were discontinued not many years later. They worked fine but no better than a traditional worm in my view point. In fact liked them less as they tended to get hung up on branches, lotus stems, etc... Thought a little more it it did come in fry and crawdad also and were call Caterpillar Worm, Grub, etc.... They were heavily salted the way I recall, like someone added a dry tsp of salt to each bag (remembered every time I would take a dip from the can that darn salt). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNC Molds N Stuff Posted May 17, 2015 Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) Making the master will have its challenges too, but I already have that figured out. If each leg does not have to be absolutely perfect the way to do (for the average DIY shop) is chuck up a piece of straight stiff wire in a cordless drill and turn them against a bench sander. I've made "pretty good" tapered pins that way many times, using tig welding wire, finish nails, and pre straightened spring wire. It would be impractical to turn them on a lathe. In mass production they could be made with rollers, but probably the fastest and easiest to make multiples would be with a stamping press. Edited May 17, 2015 by Bob La Londe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRammit Posted May 17, 2015 Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 Bass Pro Shops made the worm you are wanting JRammit about 20 years ago or so. They made grubs and worms and I think french fries but could be I just ripped the tails off as they were little sickle tails that weren't very sturdy. I probably fished a thousand or so of them one year when I actually fished a lot. I didn't buy any more after that and they were discontinued not many years later. They worked fine but no better than a traditional worm in my view point. In fact liked them less as they tended to get hung up on branches, lotus stems, etc... Thanks Travis... If its already been done i wont bother... Thing is, think i finally figured out how to do it.... Never actually did a proper search, just assumed it hadnt been done cause ive never seen one............. Oh well, on to the next! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRammit Posted May 17, 2015 Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 The validity of my tests has to be questioned too, as I don't have access to plastisol. The testing that I did was with e meltable rubber. A lot stronger and stiffer than plastisol. Can't remember the name of it, but I think it would make good baits with the right design, to take into account the less flexible medium. The ribbed bait in the link would be no problem. Dave Surely theres a tackle shop near by where you could pick up a bag of worms to melt down??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted May 17, 2015 Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 Just because it has been done no need not to try and repeat. They used injection molding to do it but no reason why you can't tinker with other ways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRammit Posted May 17, 2015 Report Share Posted May 17, 2015 I may try it at some point... Concepts are stacking up on me!!!... My mind works too fast for my hands!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted May 18, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 18, 2015 Travis - I agree, there is room for improvement for existing types of lure. What I really need to find, is somewhere to get models printed off in 3D, then I could produce something that would make people pay attention. But, as long as I am using cocktail sticks and kiddies clay, I will just be an eccentric joke. JR - yes, that is a possibility. Not even sure if they sell plastics. Everyone fishes with bait here, I have never seen anyone throwing an artificial. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Rennie Posted September 16, 2015 Report Share Posted September 16, 2015 Very interesting thread. I look forward to seeing how you and JR get on with the new improved technique. I'd definitely prefer to pump the air out than suck it. The plastisol I have has a pretty toxic whiff to it and I've started using a respirator. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRammit Posted September 16, 2015 Report Share Posted September 16, 2015 Very interesting thread. I look forward to seeing how you and JR get on with the new improved technique. I'd definitely prefer to pump the air out than suck it. The plastisol I have has a pretty toxic whiff to it and I've started using a respirator. Agreed... I achieved filling a single cavity mold with a 12v air pump, the kind used to inflate/deflate pool toys... But for a multi cavity i will need more power... 2 options in mind for this, i will try the simpler of the two first Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted September 16, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2015 Dave Rennie - Yes, I would never recommend manual suction. Too many things to go wrong. If done right then no problem, but I will keep that to myself. I am currently heading towards a project that will use Vacu-Venting, but I haven't decided on the vacuum method yet. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Rennie Posted September 16, 2015 Report Share Posted September 16, 2015 Agreed... I achieved filling a single cavity mold with a 12v air pump, the kind used to inflate/deflate pool toys... But for a multi cavity i will need more power... 2 options in mind for this, i will try the simpler of the two first I have a foot pump that deflates a king size inflatable mattress that could work nicely. Do you still use the dowel/copper pipe injection system with this vacuum method? Dave Rennie - Yes, I would never recommend manual suction. Too many things to go wrong. If done right then no problem, but I will keep that to myself. I am currently heading towards a project that will use Vacu-Venting, but I haven't decided on the vacuum method yet. Dave I look forward to seeing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRammit Posted September 16, 2015 Report Share Posted September 16, 2015 No injector.. The mold is hand poured and the vacuum fills the cavity Here is mine... The long legs and tiny antennas are connected to the vaccum duct via small short vents The only mistake on this mold is the suction entry on the side, makes it difficult to get a good seal, but it still works....... Hopefully in a few days time ill have the new mold completed and tested Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Rennie Posted September 16, 2015 Report Share Posted September 16, 2015 Thanks for that. So if it was a larger multi cavity mold, could the plastic be poured into a funnel at the top, providing the funnel was tight in the mold? I'll try and draw a quick sketch later to show the idea I was going to try before I registered with this forum a few days ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
