WyldOne

Eyelets

31 posts in this topic

I'm a bit stuck on eyelets.

I want to know should I have a wire going through the body of the lure up to the bib or should I have screw in eyelets? I know that if I have a wire coming from the body to the bib, it is going to give the bib a bit of added strength.

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I think it depends on the material you're using to make your lures.
I use pine, poplar, douglas fir, all woods with enough strength that longer sst screw eyes (1" and up), set in epoxy, or twisted sst wire eyes, again set in epoxy, work fine.
I haven't made, only repainted, balsa and plastic lures, so I can't comment on them
You can always make a sample piece with the eyelet you'd like to use, and test how strong it is. If you can't pull it out, the fish can't, either.
A word of advice. Whichever method you use, screw eyes, twist wire, or through wire (which I've never peronally attempted), don't use 5 minute epoxy. It is water resistant, not water proof. Water seems to find a way along the wires, even with a good epoxy topcoat, and eventually they can loosen, and unscrew, or let water into the lure. Use the D2T 30 minute epoxy, which is water proof, not water resistant. A little more time in the process can save a lot of heartache later.

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Mark,
I think you really want to scare me (don't believe that).
You mentioned this problem before, in another thread.
The last thing I do to a crankbait is to glue in the lip using 5 min. epoxy. Now do I have to believe that all the lips of my crankbaits are going to fall off eventually? Or perhaps you used the 5 min. epoxy not when it was very fluid, but at the moment it began to harden?

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rofish,
I don't mean to scare you (BOO!!!). :wink::lol:
I just had two sst twist wire hinges on the last, single hinge sections of two swimbaits unscrew while I was fishing them. The first one I just drilled out and re-glued, and thought no more about it. When it happened again, I looked closely at the glue that came out when I re-drilled it, and saw it was "mushy". At that point, I took apart the other hinges on that lure, and found that water had gotten into all the twist wire portions of the hinges, which were all set in Devcon 5 minute epoxy. So I read the directions that came on the epoxy box, and, low and behold, the package said "water resistant", while the package for the 30 minute Devcon 2 Ton epoxy said "water proof".
I still have lures that were assembled with the 5 minute epoxy. I will watch them, especially the single hinge tail sections. I am hoping the single hinge application subjected the twist wire to rotational forces that don't apply to double hinge joints. But, as I said, I found mushy, punky glue in the double hinge twist wired holes when I drilled them out. Maybe the glue is still strong enough to prevent pull out even if it gets wet, but not to prevent unscrewing. I don't know.
I am not concerned enough, at this point, to take the other lures apart until they begin to fail.
I posted the warning twice because I know how much work goes into lures, and don't want someone else to have a failure that this precaution might prevent.
You may not face this problem. Maybe your 5 minute epoxy is water proof. I am not familiar with European glues. I only know what I read about the Devcon 5 minute epoxy I used. Edited by mark poulson

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Guys......Forgive me for butting in........but.....
I made a bunch of lures for Blue Fishing here in Jersey. I experimented with both 5 min. and 30 min epoxy (Both Loctite products) for my screw eyelets and got the same result. I was able to catch one 2 ft. long Bluefish. They are quite aggressive so it was a good test. After that the eyelet was ripped out by another. I went through this all day and burned about 10 lures. My woods are white oak and hickory. That evening I took a spare body blank I had made and tried using a waterproof glue. I painted it and clear coated with polyacrylic. The following weekend I went back the same spot on the bay. Low and behold the glue made the diference. I fished all day on the same lure. Infact I still have it....it has been used to haul in 3 dozen or so bluefish (from 15" to 30") and a 21 inch striped bass. 4 fishing days total. The finish is really messed up due to the agressive teeth of the Bluefish but the eyelets are still burried strong as new. Guess what kind of glue it was?

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Mark,
To glue in the lips I used 5 min. Devcon, then a Chinese made epoxy, then a transparent 10 min. epoxy in squeeze tubes, which is made in Uruguay:lol: I wonder which one is the best.
Sonny,
From some thousands miles away, I cannot guess what kind of reliable glue you have used for the eyelets. So do tell me.

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Sonny,
Give it up! :bull:What glue worked? :wink:

Rofish,
Talk about an international lure! :yay:

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Wyld, on deep divers with the line tie out on the lip, I don't make the line tie a part of a thru-wire frame. It's just too hard to get it right and the lip straight. On baits with the tie point on the nose, yes, that is a part of the wire frame.

I've never had a failure using 5 min Devcon to glue in lips or hook hangers, over several hundred baits. These are all bass baits, not baits for bluefish or Muskies. The 5 min epoxy always gets covered by a clearcoat of either 2 Ton Epoxy or Dick Nite polyurethane.

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LoL.......it was just Elmers Outdoor Glue from Home Depot.....However, I wouldnt reccomend it to anyone just yet. The real results will come when one of these lures is a year or two old.....

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Sonny. That is the one thing that scares me, the feedback loop is years! I'll get creative with the bodies and lips, but if I am going to sell baits, I will be sticking firmly to the advice given here, by very experienced members, when it comes to glues, sealing and top coats. Edited by Vodkaman

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I wondered if I had used a bad mix in the 5 minute, but I mix on a piece of blue painter's tape stuck to my bench, and the mixing stick, a wooden toothpick, is always stuck solid after about 15 minutes.
Maybe my 5 minute was old. But I am going to stick with D2T 30 minute from now on. I make enough lures at once that the extra working time lets me mix a batch and do a few, instead of one at a time.
I'm intrigued by the Elmer's glue, but I am concerned that it may not last, especially if it's made from "wabbits". :wink:

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Vodka
Successes take years to prove.....failures only minutes.
I think the Elmers is real tough at first, but with repeated exposure (especially to salt water) it is going to break down. I cant seem to find any Devcon locally. I have tried the Loctite products from Home Depot.....both the 5 minute and 30 minute variety turn to mush in the salt water. It took only minutes to do so.........

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[quote name='Sonny.Barile']Vodka
Successes take years to prove.....failures only minutes.
I think the Elmers is real tough at first, but with repeated exposure (especially to salt water) it is going to break down. I cant seem to find any Devcon locally. I have tried the Loctite products from Home Depot.....both the 5 minute and 30 minute variety turn to mush in the salt water. It took only minutes to do so.........[/quote]

Sonny, that sucks! Especially since I just bought a syringe of the 30 minute from Home Depot to try out.
Hopefully, freshwater won't be as hard on it.
Can you get Devcon shipped to you? I know it's available online.

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Mark,
I am sorry that I might be the messenger of an unwanted news for you, but I think you have to know what the producer of Devcon 2 ton is telling us about the product being water proof or water resistant:
[url=http://www.devcon.com/products/products.cfm?familyid=179]ITW Devcon | Two of the most recognized brands in all of industry; Devcon® and Permatex®.[/url]

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rofish,
That's strange. The package of D2T I have clearly states "water proor" and the 5 minute package says "water resistant".
Go figure! Another "crisis"! :lol:

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Mark,
You know what the real problem is?
The real problem is that in this case the English language has way too many (2) of expressing the same thing (at least this is my guess).
In my mother's language, there is only one way to express such a thing. So no one argues about the meaning of the 2! :lol:

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rofish,
You're right.
It's like when your wife says, "It's okay, go ahead and fish, I don't mind". You never know what that means!

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[QUOTE]
You never know what that means!
[/QUOTE]

When did YOU get married, last week!

I've been wed [SIZE=3][B][U][I]to two too[/I][/U][/B][/SIZE] many!

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That's the problem, they could not [I]train[/I] me!

Sorry guys. I use 0.032 SS wire, formed in a loop, in a 3mm dia hole, fixed with resin. I looked resin up on the web, it too is not water proof, but apparently, nothing is! Edited by Vodkaman

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What I wanted to say is that I started with through wire construction, then I changed to twisted wire eylets, then I made some with the through wire construction again. I find this one to be easier to accomplish than a through wire construction, because if the wood you are using is not balsa, you have to make grooves in the wood for the wire, so that the 2 halves meet in every point of their surface, and that's a tedious thing to do.
V-man,
0.032" = 0.8128 mm x 2 = 1.6256 mm
I use about the same wire. I thought I would need to drill holes with the diameter of roughly double the diameter of the wire. At first I used 2 mm drill bits, and now I use 1.9 mm. The twisted wire must be straight. I think 3 mm holes is too much for that wire.
And by the way: we are all trainees here, aren't we?:)

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With a smaller hole, it is much more difficult to get the resin in. I deposit a few drops with a tooth pick, then work it in to 'wet' the surface inside the hole. Then I place the loop in the hole and feed the resin in drop by drop, until filled.

The surface tension of the resin is strong enough so that I can do all the eyelets without spilling. The time available before setting, allows me to do about half a dozen lures, in front of the TV.

The larger hole gives a larger contact surface with the body material, less chance of it pulling out. Plus, it is compatible with my resin bodies. I did a 24hr pull test, started 1 hour after pouring (12Kg), with no problems. Even the loops did not distort, though that might be a problem. I don't twist the wires, they go in straight, works fine for me.

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I have used the stainless cotter pins and wire formed in the fashion described by Gene (Lincoya) and never had any fail.

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I use sst cotter pins, set in epoxy, in a hole approx. 1 1/2 times the diameter of the pin. I try to bend the pin tips out, and put a belly in the two pin sides, and rough up the edges of the pins by "biting" them with diagonal cutters, just to put a series of dents in them for the epoxy to adhere to. I think the epoxy would pull out of the wood before the pins would pull out of the epoxy.

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rofish,
You made me curious, so..........
I went on the Devcon site, and asked about both the 5 minute, and their 2ton 30 minute, and this is what the technical representative said:

"Mark; The 5-Minute is what is referred to as water resistant, which
means
that the plug/lure that catches on a branch or rock and snaps the line,
so
that it stay immersed will fail over time. The 2 Ton Epoxy is water
proof
and will not be affected except for a slight yellowing over time. Many
people that make jewelry and fishing lures use the 2-Ton and many Fly
makers
use the 5-Minute. Thanks! Have a great forth!"

So the verbiage on the website is wrong, or at the least confusing.
That's a relief. I'd hate to have coated lures with something that wasn't water proof.

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