Jump to content
Devcon topcoat issues
45 replies to this topic
Posted 16 August 2008 - 08:28 PM
I am using the devcon 2 ton epoxy for my topcoat and i am running into issues with small "dimples" in it once it dries. I am applying the epoxy with epoxy brushes, heating it to eliminate air bubbles prior to putting the lure in the turner, but I still seem to get a few here and there. It might be dust/ dirt, but I keep my area as clean as possible. Anyone else having these issues? Is there a better topcoat?
Posted 16 August 2008 - 08:33 PM
Oils from your hands can cause epoxy problems as well. Yes there are much better top coats out here. You must search these boards and find the one that works best for you.
Posted 16 August 2008 - 08:37 PM
I use 2 Ton also and have not had problems like that since I started using a blow dryer. I place my bait in my turner and coat it real good with the Devcon, then I turn on the turner and run the blow dryer over the baits. It seems to really smooth out the Devcon, and it drys good and smooth and clear.
Hope This helps.
Posted 16 August 2008 - 09:52 PM
There lies your problem. Don't heat it after you've applied the Devcon. Let it dwell for a few minutes after you mix it to release air, or heat it a little while mixing. If you take the time to brush out air bubbles, you can avoid all that. I never concern myself with air. My epoxy is full of air after I mix it, but brushing it out elminates it, and I can't remeber the last time I saw an air bubble in a cured lure. also another example of using quick-set epoxies. Think sllloooowwwwww cure.
Posted 16 August 2008 - 10:28 PM
I think maybe your brush is not wetting out the lure surface properly. Like Striperknight, I mix the heck out of Devcon. Then I use a soft flat artist's brush to smooth it out on the lure. If done properly, brushing gets rid of 99.99% of any bubbles. I don't see any need to heat the lure afterwards. If I see a small bubble, breathing on it usually gets it gone. Some guys use a coarse flux brush to apply epoxy, then throw them away. I think you can do a much better job with a 1/4" artist's brush that has fine bristles which Plaster of Paris bubbles as you brush the lure. Clean it "vigorously" in denatured alcohol, lacquer thinner or acetone and brush it dry on a clean cloth. My current brush has lasted 2 yrs.
Posted 16 August 2008 - 10:59 PM
you want the way to fix it let me tell ya cause i had the same problem with bolth devcon and etex.
it was from oils and or dust ......
shoot a clear coat over the plug and let dry befor you epoxy problem solved.......
Posted 16 August 2008 - 11:06 PM
Thanks for all the tips and help, even got a phone call from a member giving me a few hints. I'll try them all and see how it works! The hell of it is that when I was doing a few lures here and there I had great success, but since my volume is up and I am in more of a hurry these problems have cropped up. Thanks again-
Posted 16 August 2008 - 11:10 PM
I disagree. A 1/4" coarse brush is the best for epoxy, unless it's a tiny lure. You need the coarseness to forcefully wet out the lure surface. That's a unique property of epoxy. It levels out rather well. I put my lures on the rack with brush marks all over, and they turn out like glass.
Edited by Downriver Tackle, 16 August 2008 - 11:11 PM.
Posted 16 August 2008 - 11:52 PM
Wow; lots of differences in methods and results. Maybe, there is more than one issue being dealt with. Personally, I use kid's crafts brushes from wallyworld; 30 for $2.50. disposable.
I have tried to clean brushes but they never seem to work properly a second time for me.
When ever I try to rush the work, problems crop up. Sometimes dimples or very small uncovered areas can go undetected by not having good light or rushing my inspections.
Posted 17 August 2008 - 12:36 AM
Guess this a litteral case of "different strokes/different folks". I never have a problem wetting out the surface with Devcon. I think of it as laying on epoxy rather than forcefully brushing it, and I want to keep the brush loaded so I'm not dragging a "dry" brush over the surface. I use inexpensive square "blending brushes" that cost $8-9 for a 6 pack. They're not really "soft" bristled but they're way softer and finer than a coarse bristle flux brush. End result? - same glass like coating as DT:)
Guys who do it regularly develop a routine that works for them and it's always different from someone else's. It doesn't matter as long as we get to the same finish.
Posted 17 August 2008 - 12:56 AM
Here are my comments for what they are worth as I have been through your problems more times than I care to remember. First thing is the epoxy, good quality is a must this is why everyone will recommend D2T or Envirotex, both these are proven epoxies. Second, well sealed wood as air problems which create craters and dimples can be air release from the wood and not the exoxy, remember if you are using heat to smooth and level then you are going to expand the air within the wood which will then force its way out into your top coat, I have in the past created craters like volcanoes.
Third is cleanliness, silicone and grease marks will prevent the exoxy adhering to the surface and thats when you get your classic 'dry' spots where the epoxy pulls away from the contaminated area, these are of a quite different appearance than craters or dimples. I would suggest that dust does not come into the equation as all this does is sit in and on the epoxy and not look nice, it is an aesthetic corruption.
Next is something that I believe is very important, this is temperature and humidity. Epoxy does not behave well in high humidity and low temperatures. I cured a load of my problems with the purchace of a de_humidifier which has a heater incorporated. A dry atmosphere and warm environment will encourage epoxy to behave.
Posted 17 August 2008 - 06:33 AM
BobP and philB; Thank you for taking the time to record your experiences and the reasoned way you present your observations. Most of all I wanted to complement your writing skills; I still "smell" a book on luremaking. Wouldn't it be awesome to include sections on some of the "masters" past and present? Woody Bell (early Japanese lure designer?), Tennesse Tuffy, Bagley, and so on.
Yes, I am sober, ken
Posted 17 August 2008 - 09:55 AM
Everyone who responded to silverdoctor's problem was possibly correct. Eliminating or preventing any possible surface contamination before applying any clearcoat is always necessary. If you're going to heat your epoxy, then the lure must be thoroughly sealed, as philB noted...and as anyone who has ever tries to seal balsa with heated epoxy immediately learns .
Posted 17 August 2008 - 10:37 AM
I wasn't saying your technique was wrong. Just disagreed that a fine brush "can do a much better job", as you posted. Maybe with urethanes or acrylics, but brush doen't matter too much with epoxies. I buy packs of 85 1/4" disposables on Ebay for around $10.
Posted 17 August 2008 - 12:12 PM
Using the hair dryer on the bait, after the epoxy is applied and while it is turning on the wheel, to just smooth it out works great for me. I don't heat the bait, just blow the epoxy with a little worm air to smooth it out. What can I say, it works good for me.
Posted 17 August 2008 - 02:07 PM
All great tips, but like Striperknight & smitty mentioned, craters or voids in an epoxy finish is most likely oil/wax contamination.
Heating & various application methods will improve or ease the application an epoxy finish, but if the surface is contaminated, oils & waxes will "repel" the epoxy from flowing or wetting out properly.
Make sure you have adequate light to inspect your application if you are brushing on epoxy, its real easy to miss a spot, if you indeed covered the entire surface & voids continue, then its contaminated.
Smitty's solution of adding a barrier coat is one fix, another would be to avoid touching the body with bare hands & make sure you have a good water/oil trap, along with a filter on your air lines (if airbrushing).
Posted 18 August 2008 - 05:12 AM
One coat of good epoxy PAINT, not glue, and you're done
3-5 coats of moisture cure? Naw!
Posted 18 August 2008 - 11:56 AM
IMO, epoxy has a single advantage over moisture cured poly - it levels out and hides surface irregularities extremely well. Otherwise, the poly is tougher and slicker. On the high end japanese bait repaints that Rookie is famous for, DN wins hands down. Thin, clear, glossy and tough as nails. Just what he's looking for.
A few TU'ers (well, maybe just Dean!) use multiple coats of Dick Nite as their standard clearcoat. It makes a very durable lure but takes several days to apply. If you've ever sanded moisture cured poly like DN to prep a repaint, you'll see why guys choose it.
TU'ers are roughly divided between guys who build baits as a hobby and guys who are into production for sale. The different perspectives mean alot when choosing equipment and finishes.
Haven't had so much fun since the Devcon-ETEX skirmishes! Cry "Havoc!" and loose the dogs of war!