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sealing the wood
63 replies to this topic
Posted 04 January 2009 - 02:02 PM
DT, I think that was Palmetto was thinking, me too. It would probably solve the blushing problem by slowing down the evaporation.
Posted 04 January 2009 - 02:16 PM
No argumentative response is necessary to this statement.
I want to get a gallon of Eastman n-Butyl Propionate (a solvent) to test with the Propionate pellets (a solid) that I have been using with Acetone (a solvent). I think that the Eastman n-Butyl Propionate will help retard (slow) the evaporation of the Acetone and prevent the blushing.
If this works and the blushing can be prevented then I think I can follow through with the testing I have already done. I made a very nice sprayable paint with the Propionate/Acetone solution and tried a few different retarders with it. If the humidity was a little high the Propionate paint that I was airbrushing with would blush.
I want to get a gallon of the solvent to continue my Propionate paint testing and to add to the Propionate sealer dip.
Posted 04 January 2009 - 02:31 PM
No wisecrack necessary to my reply. Your vague response would leave many to take it as I did. My apologies. Yours accepted too.
It would probably work well as a blend with acetone. It would take forever to dry by itself. I'd start around 10:1 acetone to EEP. Another benefit would be that being similar in chemical structure, you'd probably get a thinner material with less solvent.
Posted 07 January 2009 - 08:33 PM
with a 60 to 40 percent mixture of etex to distilled alcohl is it still strong enough to seal the plug.......should i try closer to a 70 to 30 or just stick with plain etex
Posted 08 January 2009 - 01:21 AM
rclark12 - I use Devcon 2 Ton 50/50 with denatured alcohol. Etex already contains solvent so I'd just try diluting it less or using it full strength. One reason I like the Devcon is it cures much quicker.
Posted 09 January 2009 - 09:04 PM
Brought the subject up to our X-treme chemical guru today. He was familiar with both types of materials. His opinion was that it would be a waste of money to use EEP. I was wrong. It has nothing chemically similar to proprionate besides the fact that both are reacted with proprionic acid. You'll see no viscosity benefit. It goes for about $25/gal in pails for us(probably $50-75 at retail, if available), so you can accomplish the same thing with more readily available and cheaper solvents.
Posted 09 January 2009 - 09:51 PM
rclark - It's glue. Buy a 30 ml double syringe at Walmart for $2. Get the Two Ton, not the 5 minute variety. Other 30 minute epoxy brands might also work but this one is popular for undercoating and topcoating.
Posted 09 January 2009 - 10:02 PM
so two ton denatured alcohol 50 50 mix is strong enough for sealing and over coat... seems like tht would dilute it too much... and how many plugs can you seal with tht little bit
Posted 10 January 2009 - 01:41 AM
etex sealing with DA, ive done 50/50 66/33 and 75/25
either way they came out nice
50/50 let the batch go longer way with maybe 20 plugs I was sealing at once
really love this method
I never really wanted to do full strength as its important to me to be thin enough to seal the inside wire through area without me killing myself trying to make sure its all in there.
It's good to hear this works with Devcon 2t because i was told it doesnt. Now I just need to find D2T in larger quantity. Those syringe thingys just not a lot in them even compared to what I am used to buying with etex quantity
If you are doing screw eyes types of lures, go for 90/10 maybe
Edited by jameso321, 10 January 2009 - 01:47 AM.
Posted 10 January 2009 - 08:15 AM
i personaly fnd it pretty interesting tht the etex is strong enough even at a 50/50 mix!!!!
so you do it in a bucket and let the pugs soak?
and does it give them a real hard finish or just seal them
Posted 10 January 2009 - 11:43 AM
No. These lures are 2-3 oz saltwater lures. They are pretty big. You take two 16oz solo beer cups and at least 1oz ( am usually working with at least 2oz and at least 10 lures) of the etex/da solution. Poor the solution from cup to cup covering the lure inside and out. Wear gloves, goggles.
I suppose if you have small crank baits and were sealing enough of them, you could mix something like 4oz and drop them in there.
Posted 10 January 2009 - 12:29 PM
Just starting in this fun hobby/want to start a business/ want to become rich/ want to retire wealthy/ I don't know what I'm doing. But I am trying to read up as much as I can and sometimes get over whelmed with the info. Is the proper process to shape the lure, sand , prime, paint and then e-tex? I haven't done woodworking and painting since my pine-wood derby days 35 years ago and I know that my lures have to with stand more torture than rolling down a track. Thanks guys and gals
Posted 10 January 2009 - 12:39 PM
Welcome to TU Goonsdad. It is good to have ambitions and I wish you luck with it.
You missed out seal coat, after sanding. The seal coat serves several functions. It provides an additional waterproofing boundary, in addition to the top coat. It adds strength, especially with lighter woods like balsa. It also improves the finish by preventing the grain from rising and becomming visible through the paint.
After sealing, a light sanding will remove any raised grain and you have a great keying surface for the paint process.
Posted 10 January 2009 - 12:59 PM
This may sound goofy but has anyone tried "Thompsons Water Seal" to seal the wood?
Posted 10 January 2009 - 01:00 PM
B.T.W. Vodkaman thank you for the warm welcome, many ambitions soooo little time.
Posted 10 January 2009 - 01:06 PM
The Thomson's does not provide good adhesion for the paints that go on top. Better to use a proven and tested method of sealing.
Posted 10 January 2009 - 01:44 PM
Rclark - No bucket soaking lures in epoxy. You'd end up with a big bucket shaped hunk of epoxy with your lures permanently preserved inside it like a flies caught in amber:lol: A bucket of epoxy would cost a fortune - once you mix epoxy, it's gonna cure hard. So you want to be mixing batches that are just enough to do the job at hand.
The only reason you add solvent to epoxy is mechanical: to get it thin enough to brush on a lure easily (topcoat) or to get it thin enough to soak into bare wood (undercoat).
For undercoating, you want to mix the Devcon Two Ton epoxy, then mix in an equal volume of denatured alcohol, then brush it on. If you don't have a lure turner, you can brush it on, leave it for a couple of minutes to soak in, then wipe it off with a cloth and hang it to cure. Or if the epoxy solution is very thin, just hang the lure to cure and let the epoxy drip off the tail. Sand lightly afterward to remove the gloss and get a smooth surface for painting.
Undercoating is different from using epoxy as the lure topcoat, though you may use the same epoxy for both jobs. In undercoating, you're trying to give the bare wood some waterproofing in case the topcoat fails in the future and you're also preventing the grain of the wood from swelling when you paint the wood with water based acrylic paint.
When you topcoat with Devcon Two Ton epoxy, you mix it up but only add a very few drops of solvent (the less the better; none if possible). Then you brush it on and turn the lure for 30-45 mins while it cures so the Devcon will not sag. Envirotex Lite contains solvent and is already very thin, so you don't need to add solvent. But it cures slower so you need to turn it longer, and you usually need to do multiple coats. Hope this helps.
Edited by BobP, 10 January 2009 - 01:46 PM.
Posted 10 January 2009 - 03:12 PM
Funny when people mention making money.
You would make more money working at Burger King for your time invested.
Posted 10 January 2009 - 03:58 PM
It all depends on how much money you (and your customers) think your time is worth. I have to scratch my head at the folks who will spend hours hand crafting a bait only to put it on Ebay and practically give it away.
Of course convincing the customers that your time is worth what you ask is another entire topic unto itself. If you build a good reputation and are always on top of your customer service there's no reason why you can't earn some tidy cash from selling your baits.