matt duarte Posted January 28, 2009 Report Share Posted January 28, 2009 ok well i was looking on youtube and came across this vid of a guy making a glider..he shaped it and pre drilled all the holes needed and sealed the bait with etex.. and then painted and put etex again to finish the bait...so can etex be used to seal the wood? it seems like it would work..i use minwax wood hardener.. it looks like it work but when the bait i test a bait after the minwax is completly dry it still seems like its not water proof... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seafoam Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 Yes I do believe it can be used as a sealer of sort but if you should put a chip in the Etex it would allow water to soak into the wood grain,don't believe Etex soaks into the wood grain like a water based sealer would. Maybe someone else could chime in that has more experience with it,don't take my word for it,just pondering here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 It's waterproof, it adheres well, it levels well - sure you can use Etex. I use D2T cut 50% with denatured alcohol and it works fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt duarte Posted January 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 awesome guys thanks! the mixwax wood hardner seem like it work but when i test the swimbait it doesnt seem to repell water every well... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
21xdc Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 I thin e-tex with acetone and use as a sealer. Works good for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamie Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 yes the etex when brushed on will soak into the wood. It will level out nice and gives a good flat surface. Sometimes it takes several coats to get a smooth surface to work with because the etex soak in the grain.The down side is having to rotate your bait, the dry time, it can add a little more weight to your bait, and humidity and temp plays in to the dry time. I do this with muskie baits before foiling with foil tape, it give a nice clean surface that you can wipe down for a contaminent free surface for good bond.I have been fooling around with the idea Pete had brought up a while back with vacuum sealing baits. You can see the air being sucked out of the wood and bubbles form., then the sealer gets sucked in when you release the pressure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 Guys, If you try the PVC decking materials now available from lumber yards and home centers, you'll eliminate all the sealing problems. The material itself, a blend of PVC plastic and sawdust, is totally waterproof, so it requires no sealing. And, since it doesn't absorb water, it doesn't swell from water absortion, which is what makes the paint scheme/top coat fail on wood lures once they're scratched or dinged. It is harder than most woods (think muskie teeth), but it's still buoyant. And it's consistent. No grain to fight. I'm a carpenter, I love working wood, but, since I've discovered PVC (thanks JRHopkins) the only wood baits I work on is refinishing my old ones for myself and my friends. I don't have that problem with the PVC baits I've made. Even when I've hit the rocks with them (a controlled test, of course) all that happens is that the epoxy gets scratched. Doesn't dent or chip or peel. Amazing. I use AZEK decking. The one I bought came 15/16"X 5 1/2" X 16', and cost $65. I can get almost 100 four piece lures out of one length. And I don't own stock in AZEK. But I look forward to never having to refinish another lure. Now, I'm sure Featherlite Resin has the same characteristics. I just enjoy the shaping and carving process, and it's easier for me. The only molds I've ever made are forms for concrete, and for plaster staff mouldings, and those are a whole 'nother ball game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 Mark, how would you compare Azek to solid woods like cedar or basswood in weight and buoyancy? I make bass baits where buoyancy is important for lively action. Maybe that isn't the same for swimbaits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seafoam Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 Mark,thanks for the tip about AZEK,I'm going to give it a try soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 BobP, It's a little heavier than poplar. I've had to use less ballast for the same size lure, and no tail weight at all. I wouldn't use it in place of a really buoyant wood like cedar, or even pine. Because of it's weight, while it is still buoyant enough to make floating swimbaits, baits that need really buoyant wood to let you position the ballast low and still have lively action might have a problem with AZEK. The may be other PVC materials available that are lighter, but I am not familiar with them. Seafoam, Glad to share what I learned here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pikester Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Sorry that this thread is getting hijacked by the PVC Board talk but it's very intriguing! Mark, i would assume that there is still a certain amount of sanding/cutting required to get the final size & shape you want so I'm wondering about the safety factor involved in dealing with this stuff. Common sense tells me that creating dust from a product made from plastics & glues must be somewhat more toxic than just wood dust so should a guy wear a respirator when working this stuff or does a dust mask seem sufficient? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 pikester, I don't know the chemical makeup of the dust that's created by machining PVC materials. I do know I don't smell any fumes to speak of, and the sanding dust that's created seems to be really granular, instead of a fine dust. And it sticks to your hands and the parts being machined, so it doesn't get that airborne. But I do use a homemade dust collector that creates a suction at the point of machining and collects most of whatever fumes or smell there is. I'd assume that burning the PVC would release toxic fumes, but I don't think machining it with wood working tools does. And I haven't had it burn when I've cut it or sanded it. Having said that, it would probably be a good idea to check with the manuf., in this case AZEK, for their technical information. I'm pretty sure they would know if it was hazardous, since they'd be open to lawsuits since they sell it nationwide. I do wear a dust mask when I'm sanding it, because I have bad sinuses from working with wood my whole life, and I don't need anything extra getting into my lungs. But there is less dust with PVC than with wood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pikester Posted January 31, 2009 Report Share Posted January 31, 2009 So when sanding the removed material comes off more like grains than fine dust, very interesting. I would definately use a dust mask when working this stuff but it sounds less messy than wood. I will keep my eyes open for this stuff over the summer as I'm in residential construction & could probably come across some cuttings since it's gaining popularity in my area for decking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted February 1, 2009 Report Share Posted February 1, 2009 Yeah, it definately is different from wood in that way. And the sanding "dust" clings to your hands and the workpiece. And is slippery. When I finish sanding a batch, or if my hands get too slippery, I just go to the open garage door and blow the dust off both my hands and the work pieces toward the outside. And I blow it off my clothes when I'm done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MuskyGary Posted February 1, 2009 Report Share Posted February 1, 2009 How does hooks hold in it? I am assuming you exposy the hooks in. I am thinking of trying some for musky baits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted February 1, 2009 Report Share Posted February 1, 2009 Everything holds really well in PVC. I predrill for screw eyes, and they hold great. I use a small bit for the larger eyes I use for the hinges. Even though it's a tight fit and hard to turn the first time, the PVC molds to the threads. I run the screw eyes in and adjust them as needed for hinge spacing. Then I run them out for ten revolutions and I put some brush on crazy glue onto the threads before I run them back in, to lock them in place. I count the revolutions to make sure they go back to the spacing I had before. I do the same thing with smaller screw eyes, like for the line tie. All of them hold well. If I use a sinker/cotter pin combination for hook hangers, I seat that in D2T. If I use a screw eye, like on the tail sections to keep the weight down, I use the crazy glue, and make sure the top coat epoxy coats the entire eye, so it won't rotate out when a fish twists. I clean the epoxy out of the eye with a piece of sst wire. I've read here of people melting hardware into the PVC, but I haven't tried it. I've never had a muskie on, so I can't say with any authority that this will work for them. But I can say the hardware holds as well or better in PVC than in wood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jameso321 Posted February 2, 2009 Report Share Posted February 2, 2009 Etex and D. Alcohol (50/50 to 66/33 range of ratio) and heating up plugs a bit in oven (optional) is possibly the best sealing method there is, in my opinion. Etex/D. Alcohol penetrates wood grain, then it cures. You end up with 100% sealed, hardened, and durable lure compared to most other methods. Tip: get two 16 oz. solo beer cups, poor the solution from cup to cup and all over and inside of the lure. It takes about 20 seconds to seal a 2-3 ounce lure. You can prime from 24-48 hours depending on several factors. Scuff or lightly sand, then prime. Really cant say enough good things about this method Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lure--Prof Posted February 2, 2009 Report Share Posted February 2, 2009 I seal balsa with Etex. Dean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
