XLR8n

Any homemade lure making machines?

134 posts in this topic

Xlr8n, I know this post is about 6months old with no replies, so know that the board has moved here. we might get some creative juices flowin.

I'm gonna start some topics in here for the "most wanted tools"

keep an eye out. (or 2) 8O

redg8r

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XLR8N- I made a copy lathe back in the 80's, before digital cameras, so don't have any pics - had trouble with money (wife) and finding suitable cutters, would be easy now. pete

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Hey Pete, how does a copy lathe work. and what would I need to build one?

John

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Heres a peek at one we've been working on.

This prototype was made simply for proof of concept, it has many flaws & it's quite dangerous, please dont attempt.

Once we're happy with the design, we'll make it available here.

Our prerequisites were that the materials be readily available, affordable & be able to build & use in a small shop.

Feedback welcomed.

8oSMf_1nLqE

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That falls right into that group of "toys" that Mom said I'm not to play with... That is a cool tool to watch; any idea how long before I can get one at the local Tackle-R-Us store?

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Red- strait away, that blade looks ' the goods', I used a router and always had trouble with the cutting bit rotation and direction of travel, it always gave a too rough a finish.. great video and keep us up to date on that thing, they mesmerize me.

John - this is a good demo of how they basically work. LaPala posted some movies of the 'Rapala' factory tour, which gave a brief insight into the copy lathes they use. If you get to see it, you will notice they use square stock, which can be held in a square chuck, so as a lure is cut and discarded, the stock is continually fed into the machine - very simple to make and this part on mine worked O.K. I made mine with a couple of bought bearings, a router and assorted motors, chains and junk I had on hand, just for such an occasion- It did not cost much but time.

Every time I get a glimpse (don't see too many) of one, I wish I had kept at it with mine. Pete

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Red- the original copy lathe I saw was a leftover, WW2 machine, made to carve rifle butts (303), it had a bed, as big as a small bedroom, and had a cutting head similar to this, but the teeth were about 2" inches across, evil bit of machinery, never saw it working though - If you know a gun manufacturer (or cricket bats), it would be well worth a look, to see how it all works. pete

Pro-4 Woodcarver

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Redgear, that is awesome. I really hope you can make this thing safe and affordable for the small time builder. Thanks for sharing.

John

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That was absolutely AWESOME!!!!!!! Scary as all hell :eek:but damn cool! I want one and I want it today. Safe or not. I have some well not so good friends I could invite over and let them try it first. Just kidding. It is a neat little machine though and what a time saver. I am seeing dollar signs. Now to just speed up my painting abilities.:whistle:

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:lol:

Yeah, I had my employee do the first run.

What we're working on now is setting it up to feed a full stick instead of loading each blank.

As-is it cuts @ 3-4 inches per minute. I'm working with my blade sharpener to modify the teeth from a alternate bevel to a triple chip.

Another idea being passed around the shop is to switch to a router to increase safety. We have another machine sitting just for that purpose, but we're waiting on cogs/gears.

Hey Pete,

I've seen the machines your speaking of, actually I've researched this for years, There are alot of duplicators on the market, some commercial & some homebuilt, but every one I've seen requires a router & manual control.

The one you're referring to has one tracer & like 20 belt driven heads, quite a beast. They've been upgraded to CNC but this is the only one I've seen that can run without manual control (without CNC)

Thanks for the feedback.

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just awsome!! what kind of blade were you using?.think your going to have problems with using a router....laminate cutter might be better but either way bits arent going to last as long as the blade,and can see issues with depth of cut...great idea,never would have even thought it was possible lol

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The blade is a 6 1/2 Avanti...... 40 tooth I think.

I used it because it was labeled to endure the most RPM's, its rated for 10,000

The grinder does 14,000 which is why it's run thru a speed control. I put an aluminum blade guard on it but still, if someone just walked in & fired it up, it could get hairy, which is why I stress "dont try this at home"

That particular blade looks to do a 4x4 piece of wood & I made the linear slides over 2 feet long so in theory it will do a sizable musky plug (havn't tried it yet)

I agree there would be more maintenance with a ball tip router bit, but Im having some issues with the grinder bogging down near the tail & a router (1-3 hp) wouldn't have that problem, but I could always upgrade to a table saw motor & throw a 10 or 12" blade on there. :eek: (I actually think thats how Lee Sissons machines run)

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you will notice they use square stock, which can be held in a square chuck, so as a lure is cut and discarded, the stock is continually fed into the machine - very simple to make and this part on mine worked O.K.

Hey Pete, I scored a few small lazy susan bearings which had a 6 inch ID, only problem is the bearings have a little play @ 1/16" (I know the US standard measurements are killing you :wink:) do you know of a place to score some large ID bearings to pass the square stock thru?

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ESI bearing has up to 3" with set screws. I was going in another direction with smaller bearings untill I see this. Good job redg8r!

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I think I used something like 2" bearings, 6" is going to the extreme. The only bearings that big (and cheap), would be truck wheel bearings, or 'Catipillar' (expensive). From my experience with this (and a lami trimmer), you would need something solid like roller bearings, because of the harmonics/vibration. Vibration was one of the problems I had.

I'm testing the memory now, but I think I used tube and 2" bearings. As long as you are not turning the chuck too fast, I reckon you could use 6" tube and 3 bearings, placed evenly around the tube, so the tube rolls evenly inside the bearings - or even 5 bearings, see below??????????????. pete

bearings.jpg

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RED-Most of my motors, chains and sprockets etc, I sourced from an old printing machine (I think)

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Pete, we think so much alike its scary.

I actually tried that & agreed, it would work given the low rpm (@ 60rpm) & you're right a minimum of 3 bearings is all that would be needed.

My issue with that design was axial load. In order to feed the stock I needed both sets of bearings, (or tubes as you have drawn) to house a one-way ratchet type system that would allow the stock to feed in one direction, but not the other (or back itself out)

The lazy susan bearings are actually made for an axial load, but again I don't like the 1/16" slop, if you double that (one set stationary/geared & the other fixed to the Y gantry) that makes for 1/8 of play. :mad:

You could scratch the whole ratchet design in the "thru" bearings if you could push the stock from the rear, but that means running a rack & pinion or something similar outwards to 8 feet from the business end.

I hope that makes sense, i'm starting to confuse myself :teef:

Damn, I figured Vodkaman would be all in this by now :whistle:

I wanted to bring this contraption to the MO gathering but it weighs almost 100 pounds & would have to go freight.

We still have 20-some days to slim her down :)

If I wouldn't have made it to do big game baits, it would've been much smaller.

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I am reading this thread with great interest. Unfortunately, my service provider is over subscribed and my system is pitiful, five minutes to load a TU page. Also, I cannot view the video.

I think that I am getting the idea though. The non-return ratchet sounds good, but if the feed finished in between ratchet stops, would this introduce slop in the feed direction.

The play in the bearings sounds huge, OK for playing with food though. The 1/16 'slop' will not double because of the presence of two bearings. The resulting play would depend on the geometry. By locating one bearing close as possible to the business end and the second as far away as possible, the play will be minimised.

I could be way off track not having seen the machine in question. If this is the case, I apologise and you can all have a laugh. Maybe you could e-mail the vid or pic to me.

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Thank you for sharring this the one I was making was a lot more complex. Yours is so basic compaired to where I was headed and operates with more precision.

I dont think the play is that bad.

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Thank you for sharring this the one I was making was a lot more complex. Yours is so basic compaired to where I was headed and operates with more precision.

I dont think the play is that bad.

Honestly, there isn't any play in this one, as-is.

The play we were speaking of was in theory of using lazy susan bearings for uses other than what they were intended to do.

The existing machine uses piano hinges, good call, I browsed alot of hinges & was surprised how much play/slop was in them, there is some in the piano hinges also, but like what Vodkaman said, the farther you spread it out, the less noticeable it is. (the ones on this machine are @ 8" long)

Vodkaman, I totally get what you're saying & I'm blown away by how you understand without actually seeing the video :yay:

PS Sorry kelly, thanks for the info on the bearings, those would work for bass sized plugs, but I'm stubborn & dead set on carving a 4x4 with this :teef:

That means the ID needs to be around 5.5 - 6+ inches.

Thanks all.

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Red - As you say, keep it simple, that feed problem can be solved with a sliding collar (with another bearing !!!),on the square stock, and a bar hooked up to the carriage for the cutting head. As the head returns to start another run, it drags the timber through the chuck and onto the dead center. As the head starts cutting the collar slides back up the timber, ready to lock on and drag another length in.

This collar would be set up on a cantilever system similar to a 'Hi Lift' jack (without all the switches and pins etc). A more simple use of this cantilever principle (what you need), is the one way locking mechanism in a 'Mastic gun' or sliding 'G' clamps.

Saying all this, I never got this far, but that was what I was going to try and use - centering after it comes through the chuck may be a problem (use guides maybe), especially if the stock timber is not strait .pete

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right right......

this video somewhat demonstrates what I think we're both talking about.

This cnc lathe uses a support bearing to keep everything true, but that where the similarity ends. After watching the machine make it's pass, imagine the bearing locking onto the remaining blank & pulling it into place as the machine resets for the next pass.

ov3awRWfVJc&hl

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