Floater That Turns Over
60 replies to this topic
Posted 07 February 2011 - 01:35 PM
If I can get my youngest daughter to help me, I will, but no promises. First I have to figure out how to make the video.
Posted 07 February 2011 - 01:45 PM
most ordinary point and shoot cameras have a video option.
once you take the video just put it on your computer like you would any pictures you take, then go on the internet and make an account with Photobucket if you haven't already,(www.photobucket.com), and upload the video there. its as easy as that! then you can link us to the video.
Posted 07 February 2011 - 04:05 PM
Mark your work is really impressive. I'm still trying to understand what you did and if it can be down sized to fit my needs. I've got questions but I'll wait for the video or more detailed explanation.
Thanks a million!
Posted 07 February 2011 - 05:12 PM
Click on the gallery icon below my name, the little green box, and it'll take you to my gallery. I made a small shad twister that's in there. 3 1/4" long, 12 grams. It does the same side/belly/side movement when it's twitched.
Email me with any questions.
Posted 07 February 2011 - 08:33 PM
Alright, here goes nothing:
My daughter ( the camera person), her dog Charlie (a coon hound), and I made these videos. I didn't post the one where Charlie gets in the way, and I keep hitting him with my rod tip as I work the lure. Too much cussing.
Anyway, between the videos I did post, you should be able to see how the lures work on a walk the dog retrieve, and when twitched.
The sun was in our faces, and I had no idea how to make the video, so forgive the clumsy effort. My poor daughter was trying to film while Charlie was pulling on his leash, which was in her non-camera hand.
I am fishing with a buddy who is a professional videographer Saturday, so I'll see if I can get him to take some better videos, now that I've figured out my digital camera will make videos. Doh!!
Thanks for the tip, guys.
Posted 08 February 2011 - 02:53 AM
Still trying to see what you did.
Edited by bassrecord, 08 February 2011 - 03:00 AM.
Posted 08 February 2011 - 10:49 AM
Sorry the videos weren't clearer. It's my fault. I insisted we bring her dog along, and he is a 65lb handful.
Try to visualize a regular walking bait, but with a bill like a wake bait. Now turn the bill so that it's not square to the front of the bait, but is at a 30+- degree angle. When the lure is moved forward, the bill acts like a screw and rotates the bait.
I painted the side image of the bluegill on the bottom, so it faces down at rest. When I pull or twitch the bait, it rolls so that the side with the belly paint scheme faces down, and then it rolls right back up to the belly down position.
So the bait looks like a fish lying on it's side, and then struggling to turn upright, but finally winding up back on it's side.
With that in mind, look at my gallery photos again, and see if it makes more sense.
I'm not sure yet if I will fish this weekend with my videographer friend. I may have a funeral to go to, and don't know yet which day it will be.
If I do fish with him, and it's calm enough (right now there are 40mph winds), I'll ask him to try and make some better video, and I'll post it.
Posted 08 February 2011 - 01:38 PM
"I see!" Said the blind man to his deaf daughter! Finally duh! I'm starting to see what you have accomplished! Way to go! Your baits really look good. I'm not a rod and reel guy but in your video it seems like your shad mimics a dying fish like my Dad used to do by using a Creek Chub Injured Minnow. During the retrieve, both seem to go in small circles which are very attractive to LM bass but yours goes even further by turning over on its side. This bait's action, when coupled with a much slower retrieve, should be especially devastating early mornings and late evenings on top water.
I eagerly await more info and your opinions.
Posted 08 February 2011 - 03:40 PM
i like the twitching action in the first video. i'm curious as to what the bait does on a slow steady retrieve (no added action from the rod tip). does it just roll over and over or does it swim like a crankbait would?
Posted 08 February 2011 - 05:59 PM
If I swim it really slowly it kind of does a quivering back and forth between the belly and side, like it's struggling. The faster the retrieve, the faster the switch. Too fast, and it sometimes does a 360.
I think the twitch/pause/twitch retrieve looks the most like a struggling fish. Just a hard enough pull to get it to rotate 90 degrees, and then it rolls back down by itself. And I think it is really neat how the rolling action adds flash and splash to the walking retrieve.
I was surprised at how little the front hook fouled on the walking retrieve, given how much movement there is and that I upsized to a #1 Owner treble on the new lures. About the same as a conventional walking bait, which is once in a great while.
Posted 09 February 2011 - 02:27 AM
Good solution Mark. Much simpler than what I was trying to do.
Posted 09 February 2011 - 07:19 PM
Having PVC and super glue to build with simplifies my process greatly. It's easy to make a rough blank, ballast it, and play around with bills and angles because I never have to worry about sealing anything to keep water out.
So I can think about something for a little while, make a rough prototype, give it a test run in the bath tub, and refine the design pretty quickly.
I think better with my hands, anyway. I guess it's a carpenter thing.
Posted 10 February 2011 - 02:31 AM
My process was quite efficient. I cut a dozen bodies for the project (duplicator machine). I sealed with polyester resin, ready for water after 30 minutes.
The problem was that as I tried to make my idea work, the design became more and more complicated, to the point that it was not a practical build. Also, I should have started off with a larger body, to give myself some elbow room. Micro surgery on a 1.5" body just did not work out well.
Sometimes you just got to cut the idea loose and start again. Not a total loss, I did learn some.
Posted 10 February 2011 - 11:31 AM
I should have known you'd have it down to an exact science! You don't know the meaning of the phrase "half-a$$".
I know exactly what you mean about micro surgery on small lures. I wound up with some 1" sections on a few jointed shads I made, and wound up with only a belly hook in the front section, and using small sst cotter pins for the hinging. A fun challenge, but not something I would do all the time.
"Sometimes you just got to cut the idea loose and start again." Words to live by!
Posted 10 February 2011 - 12:28 PM
so i'm wondering if mark poulson's solution satisfies the criteria of the original post?
Posted 11 February 2011 - 02:11 PM
I don't think I can come any closer.
Bassrecord wanted a bait that would roll from it's belly to it's back. What mine does is a 90 degree belly to side and back action when twitched, and a full 360 degree revolution if you pull it hard and fast enough. Getting a bait that will turn 180 degrees, and then roll back down in the opposite direction, is really tricky. I suspect you'd need a computer-controlled rod to impart just the right amount of action to get it to do that, without continuing on over into a full 360 roll.
But I'm hoping my solution isn't the only one we come up with.
Posted 11 February 2011 - 02:52 PM
What I was working on was a lure that rested on its side (either side). When retrieved, it would right itself and swim normally with a wiggle action. When paused, it would once again lay on its side. This is a 90 degree rotation/cycle. The problem is that the design involves a floating lip, so that the lure will work no matter which side it rests. Then you have to restrict the lip to within certain movements. This makes the build very messy. I am sure I could get it to work, but what is the point, it is just not practical.
Design is nearly always a compromise, part of which is the simplicity of build. Marks solution, though not perfect, achieves this goal. With a bit of practice and an understanding of what the lures intention is, Marks solution fits the bill. It is a good lure for someone who understands its function, such as a builder or an informed pro, but it would never make it as a commercial venture because the average angler would just wind it in and expect it to swim.
Posted 12 February 2011 - 03:23 AM
I was hoping to discover if anybody had already developed and was willing to post a lure or fly to mimic a dying bait fish that was floating belly up and recovering and then floating belly up again. I did not see any post that met the original specifications.
However as is often the case with my stuff, specification first, then testing then specification modification seems to produce better end results. To me Mark's 90 degree side float turn over appears to be as good as or even better than a 180 degree belly float turn over solution. His more simple and practical solution makes changing the original specifications a slam dunk. His 30 degree lip seems to achieve the vortex Dave mentioned. The act of reeling in coupled with rod twitch should let you rod and reel guys make Mark's lure really dance like a dying minnow. I'd like to know how they perform on the lake.
I tried several fly tests and they all went pffffft! So I'll put the fly blanks into one of several boxes marked "Failed Projects" and move on.
Posted 12 February 2011 - 05:45 AM
Nice little set of lures Marc, good to see someone trying something rather than relying on pure physics, as they say "the proof is in the pudding".