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Caney Creek Plastic

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If there is information that is not true, I have every right to attempt to straighten out. If those guys would not speculate the costs and call Jason, they would not have to make uneducated guesses.

Jim

You have the right to say whatever you want here.. doesnt mean you should

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Jim, why don't you follow your own advice? I started a thread on Lureworks plastisol and you and only you decided to hijack it by announcing Caney Creek's plastisol. Why can't you live by your own rules? You keep making out like someone is estimating the price, you keep wanting to bring up the price of a drum of plastic when drums are not available from CCM. Again, the price is only calculated per lb from the price advertised per 5 gallons. You put a saddle on the bubble horse and rode it till it dropped on the Lureworks thread. You've made it a constant thing to personally attack people. I think Kajan's point is like several other people on here is you are biased to CCM and can't admit it. And as far as bashing a new person coming up, there again why don't you follow your own rules? If you'll remember a few months back I called you on the phone and told you that Lureworks was getting into the hand pour and hobbyist end of the business and was looking for a stand up guy to help them out, you told me then that Caney Creek was hunting for someone's plastic to distribute. I have no problem admitting that I am very supportive of a company that I have been doing business with for at least 10 years, probably more. The only thing I stated and I'm still stating, CCM plastisol comes out with shipping at a cost of $4.42 per lb. I've watched you bash Bear over the years when he first got started, and I think Kajan is also trying to state that if it hadn't been for Bear's bait, Jason may not even be in this business. I think everyone on here knows how he got his start. But that's neither here nor there to me. It's when you come on a thread that I started and hijack it, you don't expect anyone to come back with facts on another subject that by the way you didn't even start the thread on. I really think at this point you're hurting Jason's business more than you're helping it. But you are being successful at keeping this thread at the top of the board. Maybe that's your bottom line here. But of course you did get CCM's plastisol before anyone else or you were the first to post about it. Kajan and I are stating facts you're backing up a buddy. This will be my last comment on this, we already know where you stand on everything when it comes to plastisol. I used to think you were a stand up guy with a very valuable opinion, I think after today I and others have reason to rethink this. Why don't you just admit it, you're just trying to help the guy out and that's fine, we all understand that, it's just the way that you're going about it that's wrong.

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Mike, id you go back and review things, you can see I did not post up about the drums first. Others speculated, including you. This post is about CCM. If somebody posts an unrelated piece of intfo or not true info, I respond. Smallmouthaholic brought it back to the top regarding price, not me.

Kaja is talking about molds and other stuff, not the plastisol. Have you either used it? Doubt it so you can only knock it for its cost. Don't buy a Ferrari since it costs too much. Just talk about how going fast is dangerous. All ridiculous.

Jason is just another guy in the business that has treated me right. No more than that. I am not up his but like others are with their buddies. Others have not treated me right or sold me products that are inferior. If people made up shit about them, I would call that out too.

Talk about the product or let this topic die.

You all keep it going, not me.

Let's get on with micro bubbles now.....

Jim

Edited by ghostbaits
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This thread was started about us offering a new product and people liking it. Here is an e-mail I received earlier today:

The plastic is great. It is a vast improvement on the "Days of Yore" stuff. Very little smell and almost no smoke. Seems like if you are getting more than just a trace of smoke trail off the stirring device you are too hot. Dries extremely well. No plastic slickyness. Great product.

This, customers liking the plastic, is all that matters. The price, and how we offer it is between Caney Creek and those who are actually using it.

Mike, you made a statement earlier in this thread, " And yes the plastisol might be phthalate free but if you add the components, flake, softener, or hardner, then you've just added phthalates to your plastisol."

This is not true. Maybe with a different brand, but not ours. Caney Creek softener, hardner, and worm oil are all phthalate free. We use the same materials that food and cosmetic companies use in our plastic. That is why it is slightly more expensive. For our customers who care about their health and those they sell baits to this is important. On top of the health benefits - it's just flat out performs (I'll leave the comparisons to those who are non biased and using it). But the fact that it's only been out a short period and there is already bulk demand from customers who have tried it speaks volumes.

For you to say, "it really doesn't affect me because I do not sell retail" This is an area we will just have to disagree on. I don't sell baits at all, but feel I am responsible to my customers, and their customers, to provide them with a product that I would willingly and without question share with my own family. As safe a product as I can.

Next topic...

The frog thing kills me. Here are the pics, be your own judge.

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I specifically don't go look at baits companies produce to try and help avoid duplicating their intellectual property. We won't copy a bait regardless if it's protected or not. It's just a choice we have made. How much money has it cost us not knocking off the stick bait? If I won't copy a stick bait, why would I copy a frog with no brand recognition? Seriously, why would I? It's no different than the plastic - we have to make choices.

I've already been called arrogant for serving my country. So I will just put it out there as plain as I can. I am a Christian who loves God. I want everything I do to be pleasing to Him. Am I perfect, far from it. Have I sinned, unfortunately way more than I would like to admit. Have I and do I make mistakes, regularly. However, I believe intention is relevant. This is not about money for me. It's about trying to please my Creator and provide a purpose for my oldest son who will never be able to have a regular job. Do I make decisions that don't make sense to some? Probably.

It's okay to like something, or not to like something. Doing so either way doesn't mean we need to attack everything else. Just let stuff stand on it's own merit. Either a product is good or it isn't. There's no reason to make stuff up and post it on a public forum that isn't true.

Jason

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I think Kajan is also trying to state that if it hadn't been for Bear's bait, Jason may not even be in this business.

This is very true. At a very high level: I paid to have some molds made and never received them. I asked David if I bought a CNC machine to make the molds myself if he would be interested in selling them as well. We came to an arrangement where we sold molds on his site on consignment for a couple months, I think 3-4 months. The last month we were not selling them on consignment, he was purchasing them. That's it.

Was this some master plan to promote CCM? No. I had a full time job and just wanted some molds made and a way to recoup some of the money for the CNC. I had no idea it would tun into this. If I did wouldn't it have been easier to just pay $50 a month for the 4 months and advertised here? No mess, no hard feelings, etc. Do I understand how it could be perceived this way? Yes. Do I regret it? Yes. I think David felt betrayed and for that I am deeply sorry. I tried to help where I could when he started his CNC endeavors. We talk shop from time to time but I'm sure us going our own direction for personal reasons will always be a sore spot.

Since we've taken this post about as far as we can from where it started - thanks for starting it Bob (just joking). Any other questions, comments or acquisitions.

Jason

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Mike, id you go back and review things, you can see I did not post up about the drums first. Others speculated, including you. This post is about CCM. If somebody posts an unrelated piece of intfo or not true info, I respond. Smallmouthaholic brought it back to the top regarding price, not me.

Kaja is talking about molds and other stuff, not the plastisol. Have you either used it? Doubt it so you can only knock it for its cost. Don't buy a Ferrari since it costs too much. Just talk about how going fast is dangerous. All ridiculous.

Jason is just another guy in the business that has treated me right. No more than that. I am not up his but like others are with their buddies. Others have not treated me right or sold me products that are inferior. If people made up shit about them, I would call that out too.

Talk about the product or let this topic die.

You all keep it going, not me.

Let's get on with micro bubbles now.....

Jim

Jim, it is very true that smallmouthaholic brought it up and all I did was quote the prices per lb as current prices are stated. I thought it had been well established on this thread that drums are not available but at the price of $4.42 per lb the cost of the drum would be correct. It was then that your string got pulled and you yourself threw your own dog into the fight. And also I see that you are so spiteful that you've jumped back to the Lureworks thread again. You know you're probably top poster on that particular thread. Now you tell me my math was wrong, but you have yet to acknowledge whether I was really right or wrong with the math. But everything in this industry that is sold to me, other injectors, Jason and all distributors are sold at price per lb. And you've gone from using fancy words to profanity. The only reputation you are hurting is your own. Keep on and no one is going to believe what you say about either one of the plastisols. And you have yet to man up to the reason of why you didn't call or return a product that you felt was inferior, rather than getting on the forum and publicly bashing. If Jason gives an accidental mixing error or you get something from him that's not working just right as a stand up and go to guy on this forum are you suggesting to do him the same way? I know for sure I wouldn't.

Jason you are the only reason I'm responding back. Get this straight, I do not think about there is anything bad about your plastisol. I have never used your plastisol so why would I? I have not referred to it as junk and if I did have a problem with it, I would air my problem with you before I ever would badmouth you publicly. Mama taught me better. And I'm sure if anyone has a problem that you will act with superior customer service and take of the folks just as any company would do given the chance. Jason the things that we've talked about through PM's aren't referring to the quality of your products whatsoever. I've really just enjoyed hearing the make up of everything that you're working on. I think I've got some more good interesting stuff that I've found out. I'll PM you later. But again my comments were about the price per lb and nothing to do with quality or performance.

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You asked to be kept up on what they were doing. I went the extra mile and tested the samplesm for Lureworks. Sent and email back several weeks ago. No response. Nothing more to say or do I guess.

Guess the other guy is wrong in posting his results and non response too.

Give me a break Mike.

Signing off from stupid TU. Place is going back to how it was a couple years ago. No help, just a bunch of whiny people.

Jim

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Also Mike, there was no offer to return the product. They just wanted to send samples. They were worse than the other stuff.

So man up and get on the other thread and help the guy with your vast knowledge of hand pouring and the current products. Doubt you gave cooked either in a microwave so what can you say. No response is no response.

Later much.

Jim

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Yet another soft plastic's thread on this site that has gone downhill. As usual, it seems that GB is a major participant. TU used to be a good place for tacklemaking discussions and ideas. If it wasn't for the wealth of information stored in the archives and such, I'm very sure the number of active users would decline rapidly. The moderation is weak and nothing compared to any of the other sites. And to the site owner, a lot of the blame lays on your shoulders. Wake up and spend a little time moderating on here. You're lucky TU has the amount of info. it has or else this place wouldn't be much anymore. PATHETIC.....

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You asked to be kept up on what they were doing. I went the extra mile and tested the samplesm for Lureworks. Sent and email back several weeks ago. No response. Nothing more to say or do I guess.

Jim, I imagine you're not getting any response because everyone knows your agenda, and again all I was talking about was price. And in a free trade market and it being the good ol' USA all publicly advertised prices should be and always will be open for discussion. As your example of Ford and Toyota, Wal-Mart, Kmart, plastisol company A, plastisol company B, comparing prices from company to company, business to business is a common practice with anything.

Now let me man up for you, I wouldn't have offered you anything back for it by the time you contacted them either. Because you publicly stated on the forum that you were selling the stuff cheap and I think you had a couple people respond back that were interested to buy. So pretty much from your public statements, there was nothing to get the money back for. And yes I think you do need to sign off of TU, truthfully you've attacked me and others publicly. Unprovoked attacks for no good apparent reason. Prices between component companies have always been talked about on TU but apparently you decided today that there is something wrong with it. I mean really Jim, one of the main topics of mine and Jason's PM's has been the higher cost of some plasticizers versus others. And again I have not yet said there is anything wrong with CCM's plastisol. And if I did have a problem with him or with them, Lureworks, good ol' Bear at Bear's Baits, M-F or anyone else I would man up and call them directly to voice my concerns. I would never do it publicly on a forum and then turn to anyone for quality customer service. If there's something wrong with that Ford or Toyota you would naturally take it back to the proper dealership. There's been a whole lot of personal targeting on this one. I'm siging off of this thread for good but not TU. I thank Jerry for the opportunity to have a place that the prices of different companies can be discussed openly. I'm a big supporter of TU. Be it Jason at CCM, Bruce at Lureworks, or heck even you mean ol' Jim, I would help you if I could. I've always helped when I've been asked about something when I could and always will.

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Now let me man up for you, I wouldn't have offered you anything back for it by the time you contacted them either. Because you publicly stated on the forum that you were selling the stuff cheap and I think you had a couple people respond back that were interested to buy. So pretty much from your public statements, there was nothing to get the money back for. And yes I think you do need to sign off of TU, truthfully you've attacked me and others publicly. Unprovoked attacks for no good apparent reason. Prices between component companies have always been talked about on TU but apparently you decided today that there is something wrong with it. I mean really Jim, one of the main topics of mine and Jason's PM's has been the higher cost of some plasticizers versus others. And again I have not yet said there is anything wrong with CCM's plastisol. And if I did have a problem with him or with them, Lureworks, good ol' Bear at Bear's Baits, M-F or anyone else I would man up and call them directly to voice my concerns. I would never do it publicly on a forum and then turn to anyone for quality customer service. If there's something wrong with that Ford or Toyota you would naturally take it back to the proper dealership. There's been a whole lot of personal targeting on this one. I'm siging off of this thread for good but not TU. I thank Jerry for the opportunity to have a place that the prices of different companies can be discussed openly. I'm a big supporter of TU. Be it Jason at CCM, Bruce at Lureworks, or heck even you mean ol' Jim, I would help you if I could. I've always helped when I've been asked about something when I could and always will.

that right there is why you will always be a well respected contributor to this forum. every supplier and manufacturer i have spoken with that knows you has a ton of respect for you, i can't say the same for MR. Ghost Baits.

Thank you for your much valued and continued input Mike.

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...

With that said, there is one other thing I am very proud of, we have managed to get our company to a point where everything we sell is either produced by us here in the U.S., or another company in the U.S., except for our laminate bags. This may not mean anything to some, but I take great pride in the fact and hope others are trying to do the same. There is only one way we can build our country back to what it was, and it starts with each one of us.

I think this is big deal to most people here & in the fishing community in general.

Regardless, I'd like to say that I have placed a few orders with CCM and I am EXTREMELY IMPRESSED with the QUALITY of all the products and how FAST it is shipped. Put all this together and I have no reason to do business with anyone else.

THANKS CCM!!

Edited by VinceJE
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Since we've taken this post about as far as we can from where it started - thanks for starting it Bob (just joking).

Jason

Heck, I haven't even checked this thread for a month or more. There really wasn't much in the "have you actually used it and what did you think?" genre in the whole thread.

P.S. You're welcome for all the PR it generated for you. LOL.

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