A-Mac

Sorry, Another Dick Nite Question(s)

12 posts in this topic

So I have quart that is only about 1/10 full left. I've been hoarding it since the old DN went out, but was afraid to open it and risk curing the rest of what might have been my most valuable possession at the time.

Anyway, I've been readin up on the S81 and the S82 new DN batches.

For those of you that use these, do you like the water based? Is the water based as durable as the moisture cure after they are fully cured? How is the finish on the water based? Is the application any different?

Does anyone use both? Is there a reason for me to get both?

Also, does the new batch of moisture cure work like the old stuff or is there a learner curve to it too?

Thanks in advance guys.

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I have used a quart of the new DN S81 and it appears to me to be the same as the old stuff. The S82 isn't as durable for me as the S81 or as clear for that matter. I use the S81 on most everything I paint unless I need a high build then I use Etex. If you like the old DN you will like the new.

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I haven't used the S81, but did try the water based S82 when it became available. It wasn't as durable as the original DN even with 3 coats. One of the lures I top coated with the S82 developed hook rash after only one use. And this was after it had cured for at least 2 weeks. Not trying to knock any of Dick's products. Just relaying my experience with it. From what I've read here at TU the S81 has all the same qualities as the original formula.

Ben

Edited by RayburnGuy

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thanks guys. i'll stick with the moisture cure stuff.

I guess while i'm on the topic... do you guys ever get tiny bubbles in your DN?

I'm not sure if my batch just got old or what, but the last 20+ lures I've done had loads of tiny bubbles that formed on the surface. I have been brushing the DN on, and was use to a few bubbles but this is just ridiculous. I've tried letting the baits dry from an hour to a week, but it doesn't seem to matter.

I will also point out that I've moved 3 times in the last year... from Indiana, to Oregon, and now I'm in Texas and I've had the same can the whole way. There was definitely some pressure changes going on while crossing the mountains, my spare gas can would either be shrunk in or bloated depending on elevation. Do you think this would be enough to cause the chemicals to mess up?

Anyway, I might try dipping next. I just didn't want to waste any to curing, which was my main worry with dipping. When you guys dip your baits is there a process you use that works best?

Thanks a bunch guys.

live2fish~fish2live

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I think it is possible that some gas may have dissolved into the DN while under pressure. A bit like CO2 dissolves in drinks. All you can do is crack the lid daily, to let the pressure out. If you had a vacuum box, this would fix it quick.

You could make a low vacuum box for your shopvac. Ten minutes under a low vacuum would probably do the job.

Dave

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I only tried brushing a couple times and I did fight some bubbles. I think it's air trapped in the brush? Anyway since I only dip now very rarely see any bubbles.

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A-Mac, I understand the attitude toward brushing versus dipping - less wasted DN. But you waste epoxy every time you mix a batch to coat a lure. You waste some to overspray and left-over finish if you shoot any finish. And yes, you waste DN when you dip and as much drips off the lure as stays on it. Waste is a given. What is more important to me is which method gives you the best finish and the easiest application. I dip lures in S-81. Takes 5 seconds; dip, remove, hang it to dry/cure. The only bubbles I get are a few small ones that may be sitting on the surface of the DN when the lure was dipped. You can pop them with a needle if you notice them soon enough. Here's the dip waste question: how long, if at all, do you let the DN flow/drip off the lure as you remove it from the dipping jar? If you remove the lure slowly and let drops fall back into the jar, you expose the DN to moisture and, depending on how fast you use up the finish in your jar, your DN will begin curing before you can use it all (notwithstanding the use of Bloxygen). If you dip and remove the lure quickly, more excess DN will adhere to the lure and drip off after it is hung up. I started with the "slow remove" but have switched to "quick remove" after having a couple of jars of DN begin to cure. I figure those excess drips off the lure are a cheap price to pay so that a pint of DN is not ruined. And I think if you do a cost/benefit study of the various finishes used on crankbaits, you'll find DN S81 is very cost effective even when dipping it. Waste or not, it's the best performing topcoat I've found and that's the most important factor.

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A-Mac, I understand the attitude toward brushing versus dipping - less wasted DN. But you waste epoxy every time you mix a batch to coat a lure. You waste some to overspray and left-over finish if you shoot any finish. And yes, you waste DN when you dip and as much drips off the lure as stays on it. Waste is a given. What is more important to me is which method gives you the best finish and the easiest application. I dip lures in S-81. Takes 5 seconds; dip, remove, hang it to dry/cure. The only bubbles I get are a few small ones that may be sitting on the surface of the DN when the lure was dipped. You can pop them with a needle if you notice them soon enough. Here's the dip waste question: how long, if at all, do you let the DN flow/drip off the lure as you remove it from the dipping jar? If you remove the lure slowly and let drops fall back into the jar, you expose the DN to moisture and, depending on how fast you use up the finish in your jar, your DN will begin curing before you can use it all (notwithstanding the use of Bloxygen). If you dip and remove the lure quickly, more excess DN will adhere to the lure and drip off after it is hung up. I started with the "slow remove" but have switched to "quick remove" after having a couple of jars of DN begin to cure. I figure those excess drips off the lure are a cheap price to pay so that a pint of DN is not ruined. And I think if you do a cost/benefit study of the various finishes used on crankbaits, you'll find DN S81 is very cost effective even when dipping it. Waste or not, it's the best performing topcoat I've found and that's the most important factor.

Thanks for the info guys. I do use bloxygen and Extend-it (aero marine nitrogen gas blanket) every time I crack a jar.

Bobp do you add more DN to your jar as you go (when it gets too low to dip)? Or do you start with a fresh batch.

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As long as the DN in the dipping jar is roughly similar to "original" viscosity, I'll top it off. You have to maintain the level so you can submerge the whole lure. If the DN begins to thicken, that's a sign that it will develop a semi-cured skin eventually, at which point I'll stop topping off the jar. You can still use it but you have to remove the jellied skin from the jar before dipping. I usually roll up a paper towel and swish it around the surface to collect the jelled DN. Then I use the jar for dipping prototypes, cheap knockoffs, jig heads, spoons, etc - but not lures where a pristine finish is critical. You could also thin the older DN with lacquer thinner and shoot it through an airbrush or brush it on, but I haven't tried that because I'm all about "fast and easy".

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When dipping baits I have found speed into solution more important than how fast out.

Very slow in so the surface of the lure does not catch air bubbles on the way in. Once in go deep as can and stir solution lightly. This will help remove trapped air from surface. Next out of solution as fast as you like; makes no difference because surface is all ready coated with solution.

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Thanks guys! I'll definitely have to try your tips out when I get the new batch in. Nothing :censored: you off more than finishing batch after batch of what were great looking lures and making them look like crap on the last stage.

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