archeryrob Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 (edited) The top one here is a popper and the bottom a chug-nSpook, which I am just sealing so I can float test it. As you can see the popper has a 1/8 oz weight slide up a 1/4" hole toward the wire. It chugs but I still wish it would float higher and this one is pine. If I hang another 1/8 oz on the hook the lure goes vertical and will kill the action. Should I move the weight back further, reduce the weight and maybe move it back more, or something else? It does work, but maybe I am used to hollow plastic Heddon poppers. I am starting to consider two piece tood baits and hollowing out some of the center for mot bouyancy. Edited December 31, 2011 by archeryrob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowhunter Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 AR, looks like the start of a nice popper. Couple things to consider are wood density, overall shape, weight placement and amount, number of hooks, hook sizes and placement and line attachment point. I wouldn't give up on the pine just yet, but I would add a hook toward the front mass. Just estimating here but I'd put a front treble about 1 inch from the front and move the weight back about a 1/2 inch. Best bet would be to add a front hook, then test to find the sweet spot. If that doesn't work you may have to spin another one with a little more mass in the a#@! Good luck with your tuning, Douglas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted January 1, 2012 Report Share Posted January 1, 2012 Rob, because there's more wood up front, the buoyancy on a popper is mostly toward the head of the lure, not the tail. Sounds to me like you want the ballast more forward to get the popper's cup in the water. I think the only way to get the float right is to test it in water with all the hardware installed and the wood undercoated. I'd tape over the existing hole and screw in (just a few turns) a screw eye along the belly about 3/4" forward of the present hole and hang lead on it until you get the float right. If you want to adjust the position or amount of ballast, it's quick to do with a screw eye. Then weigh the screw eye + lead and voila, that's the exact ballast weight needed and its position. If you don't have a digital scale, use a bent straight pin instead of a screw eye, run the test, and then epoxy the lead into the body at the correct position. The paint and topcoat (epoxy or urethane) will only add about .03-.04 oz to the lure. I'd do exactly the same thing with the walking bait. Different guys want more/less tail depth than others, so a float test is essential on them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonny.Barile Posted January 1, 2012 Report Share Posted January 1, 2012 Tail or upfront depends on what your fishing for. If you are building your popper for the salt surf you want it tail weighted. You pump the rod then reel in the slack. What you described above is exactly "it". It usually gets hit on the pump. In fresh water I weight it so it sits level when at rest. For that scenario I normally twitch that bait (with a little rod wiggle) then let it sit a second or two and twitch again. I get most of the strikes on the rest between twitches. Hope this helps Happy New Year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archeryrob Posted January 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2012 (edited) There is plenty of cup in the water. Even with the small back end the line tye is still completely underwater. It's still about 3/4 underwater and still flat in the water. I will be fishing these in the salt, or brackish, water the most. So more wood in the back and mass farther to the back, right? Like a combo between the spook and the popper or just like the spook and weight the back to make the back ride lower? Edited January 1, 2012 by archeryrob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonny.Barile Posted January 1, 2012 Report Share Posted January 1, 2012 (edited) Look at this video it may help you out a little. Pay particular attention to the white Popper that is spinning around the 29 second mark. This isnt my video but it is the water I fish in..... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dS--gLS6q8k Happy New Year. Edited January 1, 2012 by Sonny.Barile Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted January 1, 2012 Report Share Posted January 1, 2012 (edited) Sonny, That is the most exciting fishing video I've ever seen!!!! Thanks for sharing. There is no better way to catch fish than on topwater, for the sheer thrill of the strike. archeryrob, I'm no lure expert, so I try not to reinvent the wheel. I use a similar lure that works as a guide to help me figure out how I want my lures sit to in the water. Try and find a lure that works like you want yours to work that's close to what you've made in size, and check out how it sits in the water. If I want a popper to truly pop, and throw a lot of water, I make the face a little less angled, like the Rico, put the line tie in the middle of the cupped face, and move my knot down as low on the line tie as I can get it. If I want more of a walking-type popper, like the Bubble Pop, I increase the angle, but still use the same line tie location and knot location. Sometime I raise the line tie just above center, but not much. The smallest poppers all hang almost vertical in the water, but getting a bigger popper up and popping, or walking, is hard work if it starts out vertical, so I try and weight them to hang down just slightly tail down. For my bigger Sammie/Spook type baits, I like them to float almost horizontal, with just the front 1/3 of the bait out of the water, and the center of gravity just behind the center of the bait. That way, the rear has more inertia and keeps moving when the pull stops, and that creates the side to side walking motion. If you are fishing for those Bluefish that were in Sonny's video, I hope you're ready for you lures to get crushed! Good luck. Edited January 1, 2012 by mark poulson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archeryrob Posted January 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2012 (edited) Sony, what are those football needlefish? I guess it works like a surface darter, right? I can make those, but it would be easier with a lathe. I guess they are easier as they only need a small bottom weight and through wire. Well, can't just sit around. I found some Poplar wood fir strip laying around. Marked it out, used the round rasp and hollowed out the front and drilled it for through wire Ready to be tack glued. In the vise with very small dabbes of glue to hole it. Fished shaping after glueing abd grinding out the front cup Popped back open here. I figure the hollowed out spot might help with front floatation and I can weight it any where now. I will just seal the outsides now, add the wire and weights as needed and put masking tape on it to float it. When its correct I will seal it and glue it. I could even add a tube and balls for a front jerk rattle, maybe. Edited January 1, 2012 by archeryrob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archeryrob Posted January 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2012 I'm no lure expert, so I try not to reinvent the wheel. I use a similar lure that works as a guide to help me figure out how I want my lures sit to in the water. I have very little experience chasing stripers or blues. So I am going to start making lures and then make more of what works and what people suggest. So feel free to suggest, anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archeryrob Posted January 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2012 (edited) I found them, Creek Chub Pin Poppers. Like a refrence to Bowling pins. What are there silver cups at the wire entry points on saltware lures? Also, why are the middle hook on a swivel? Edited January 1, 2012 by archeryrob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squints Posted January 1, 2012 Report Share Posted January 1, 2012 I found them, Creek Chub Pin Poppers. Like a refrence to Bowling pins. What are there silver cups at the wire entry points on saltware lures? Also, why are the middle hook on a swivel? silver cups is a nose grommet as far as the swivel my take on it is leverage for a fish not to bend the belly hook. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonny.Barile Posted January 2, 2012 Report Share Posted January 2, 2012 They are thru wired with wires that arent so flexible. So you put a hole in for the middle and put a swivel up there then pass the wire thru it. Then you do an outside wrap on the rear eye. The cups are to protect the wood from yhe heavy wire when 3 foot toothy critters are pulling on it. They put weights in the belly near the back. Most of the time it doesnt take that much because we use hard heavy woods. I make mine out of red oak. They weigh about 3 oz. I dont really do the surf anymore as I have a boat now. I have tuned it down to 1 oz. made of poplar and much smaller in length. I have been favoring the Large size Rapala Skitter Pop. It has a skinny tail and is weighted right where the skinny part starts. It runs about 1-1/2 oz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archeryrob Posted January 2, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2012 Thank you all for the help, my education continues. Now a question I have sealed my freshwater lures with doubled over wires and epoxy down the through wire hole. If that is not sificent enough for the large toothy critters pulling on them, how are the through wire holes sealed? I mean the center must be open to slide the wire though to catch the swivle, correct? Do you fill part of it and just imobilize the top parts of the swivel? Is there a video on the build of one of these, or a "how to" build on how all the parts are assembled for water tightness? The silver cups, or Nose grommets are throwing me off on how water tight they are from what I know. Which probaly is not a whole lot for salt water lures. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archeryrob Posted January 2, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) I had some free time as a buddy was supposed to come over and pour some spinnerbaits, but he did not show. How about these Sonny? I found a 1" poplar dowel siting around and cut it and rolled it on the belt sander for 10 minutes. They weight 1.5 oz as just plain wood. It should be 2 oz plus once weighted and finished. An recommended suppliers for the grommets? Edited January 2, 2012 by archeryrob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonny.Barile Posted January 3, 2012 Report Share Posted January 3, 2012 Yup I get mine from www.njtackle.com You will need three sizes. The line tie grommet should have a hole big enough to fit double your wire dia. The tail grommet should be the size of your wire dia. The belly grommet needs to fit the eye of the swivel. Hollar if you need any help....I have made dozens of these. Sonny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
