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Lip Punching Die!

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Has any of you guys ever actually got a quote from someone on making a lip punching die set? I'm looking to purchase a couple but I am struggling to get quotes from people.

Thanks

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Punching lips out of... Aluminum? Acrylic? Lexan? Fiber sheet? What?

There is a lot to consider. Getting a quote will require that you give a lot of specific information about what you want to do, and the desired end result. You probably won't find a machinist (tool and die maker, specifically) who will want to "fiddle with it" making bunches of dies until you get exactly what you want.

I might suggest posting an RFQ on CNCZone.com or a general information request on Rec.Crafts.Metalworking (usenet group). I have not noticed any RFQs on CNCZone taking more than a day to get a couple responses.

If you need help with CAD drawings before writing your RFQ Dave (Vodkaman on this forum) does that sort of thing professionally.

You might also ask Bubba on the CamBam forum for some guidance. He is a retired tool and die maker, and he fishes. I have sent him a few of the rubber baits I have made.

I have done some research on making my own dies to punch out a particular blade for buzzbaits. (I can cut O1 easily enough on my mini mill, oil quench harden it, and then hone by hand, but I don't know what the life will be. I even bought some steel to play with, but have never gotten around to that particular project yet. I expect I would charge quite a bit for doing it for somebody else from what I have learned so far.) Also then there is stamping force. For my application I borrowed on the expertise of others and determined an arbor press "might" barely be able to do the job. (Aluminum in my case) I could do it on my hydraulic press, but even with my "air over" jack its awfully slow for making a lot of blades. When I do the math its about as fast to cut them out with one of my mini cnc mills.

PLEASE. Keep us posted on your progress.

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I own about 15 die sets for blanking lips.

Custom size/shapes will run you typically about $700 for a die set for loose tolerances (.006-.008). .003 tolerance the price jumps by about 1/3

You will need to provide a cad drawing with sizes, radius of all bends, thickness and type of material.

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And you have to have a press big enough to do this, and a surface grinder to sharpen your tools. I have a 10 and a 14 ton press in-house.

If you have never done it before my recommendation is don't. One good die crash and your out $700 or more.

Not to mention you need kick presses to punch holes, make multiple bends, then there's rotary tumblers, stone, cleaning, polishing.

It's seriously cost prohibitive.

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And you have to have a press big enough to do this, and a surface grinder to sharpen your tools. I have a 10 and a 14 ton press in-house.

If you have never done it before my recommendation is don't. One good die crash and your out $700 or more.

Not to mention you need kick presses to punch holes, make multiple bends, then there's rotary tumblers, stone, cleaning, polishing.

It's seriously cost prohibitive.

I'm kinda surprised you don't make your own now. You are setup so you could do it if I recall. Just need to decide what heat source and what tool steel. There are some tricks with metal expansion during hardening with some alloys, but I noticed you mentioned tolerances. For close tolerance I suspect the punch is made exact, hardens oversize, and is ground and honed back to size. That would explain the extra cost. Of course it depends on what alloy is selected too.

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Lol a tool and die maker I am not. I'm a hack with a metal shop :)

I'd rather concentrate on turning wood there's less crashes that way bob :)

I make enough metal chips on a daily basis as it is.

Making precision punches is best left to someone who knows exactly what they' are doing. And has a edm machine :)

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Well, my punch and die projet is still on the list. Right now I am making a fixture for a totally not tackle related project. I'm making an adaptor plate to mount a lathe chuck on a small rotary table for so I can index a barley twist for cutting on all 4 sides of the stock piece so my uncle can repair an antique chair.

After I get the plate made and the chuck mounted and centered, I'll start on a mounting plate so I can quickly mount and rough align the chuck and matching tail stock on one of the mills. I am considering leaving it permanently mounted on one just for a certain type of mold mandrel.

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This is what I made about 20 years back, http://www.tackleund...__fromsearch__1

It's pretty 'agracultural' I know but it worked on sheet Lexan, Brass, and Aluminium (or whatever you guys call it), it cut and bent 20mm circular blanks - If you want standard tapered lips just cut the sides off-- Over the years I have seen a lot of these on forums, going back to the 60's (1960's), from a small ones like mine to larger ones that will cut conventional and 'coffin' lips,, no hydraulics or windmills needed , just manpower, a longer handle and some muscle, you can knock out a 100 an hour no problem. If the tolerances are close this stuff shears like tin foil.!!!

Cheap as chips to make too.

Pete

Edited by hazmail

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I use to work in a die shop for many years. I have build dies for all sort of purposes from all sorts of materials. I can't see how you could build a steel die for punching out acrylic lips. I think the acrylic would just shatter. I know some companies do cut plastices, but not something as hard as lip material. If you wanted to punch out aluminum or maybe cicuit board, a steel rule die might be possible. Either way you probably looking at a 3 point sidebevel die. I dont think you would need the tolreances Salty's mentioned. A die thats +/- 0.0010 or even greater should be fine for lips. A single one or three up die for a lip should run about $100. Die prices have dropped dramatically from when I fisrt got into the business. You would also probably need a steel backer, which would cost another $50 or so. Plus the addition of an ejection material. This is very important if your stamping metal to help prevent unwanted bending. Tat should not cost much. Then shipping costs.The problem is finding a die shop that would take work from what they would percieve as a single time customer, might be a problem.

If you have a local die shop in your area, stop in the office and talk to someone from sales.

As mentioned you would need a press that could withstand the pressure.

Also you dont need a cad design. Many die shops will take a simple drawing, providing it has all the propper measurements. You could check out some web sites. not sure if they have online quotes. Some of the places in MA that I am familiar with are Apple Steel Rule Die, Atlas Steel Rule Die, and DTS.

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You couldn't buy single station tooling for the costs you've got there. Not even close. The heat treating alone would cost you what you quoted. You want to size the punch so it's clearance is 20% of the piece (total) for best fracture and tool life.

Steel dies work great for punching lexan. You get a burr that needs to be sanded but the break is pretty good and all you need is a flat face punch/die.

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Salty, currious. I am wondering if we are talking abuot 2 different animals here and that is why the price difference is so great. The tool your talking about. Is it a single machined peice? That would cost a lot. I am talking about strips of blade that are bent and mounted into a peice of wood or other material, then sometimes put on a steel backer.

I definately think we are thinking of two different types of tools though.

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He's talking about punch dies as am I, your talking about steel rule dies for punching fabric, leather, foam etc. Those won't work for what he wants to do. Lip stock for lexan is typically .125 thick.

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