diemai

New Weightshifter Minnow Bait Prototype

43 posts in this topic

Hi there , folks ,

Just made a little video this morning displaying my latest lure design .

Some of you guys and gals out there might have seen my previous weightshifter lures made from timber turned down on a lathe , .....now I took it to the next level .

The working effort just did not become less , but this lure made of artificial material has the advantage of not being vulnerable to water sepage , provided that the glue would seal off all parts properly , ...so a careful glueing proccees is in order .

I'm still a bit concerned whether the lexan core with the mounted hook hangers would hold up well against strong fish , ........but on the other hand the epoxy glue would surely add a great deal to the lure's stability later .

Gonna test that prototype for it's casting perfprmance coming weekend , .......hope that the working week would come to pass in a breeze :huh: !

Any question or critics welcome , ............thanks for your interest , ....greetz , diemai :yay:

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Can't wait to see how that puppy performs in the water!!

Karl

Edited by bluetickhound

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Dieter,

That is a really well executed concept. Beautiful work!

I look forward to your report on the swim/cast testing.

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I'll second that Dieter,incredible concept and craftmenship...can't wait to hear how it swims..Nathan

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You put quite a bit of engineering, as well as craftsmanship, into that one Dieter. Nice job all the way. Look forward to seeing how it swims.

Ben

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I wish ...............---------'''''''''''''I could do that.

Fantastic job Dieter! Looks to swim well too!! What does this router and bit you used to shape the lexan and cut the cavity of the bait with look like?

Hope you catch a few ..........

Vic

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Thanks a lot for your kind words , folks , ..........me myself I'm eager to find out about the diving depth and especially casting performance of that lure , ......but as said before , ....gotta wait for the weekend , gonna glue the parts together this morning before going to lateshift .

From a physical standpoint it would have been of more advantage to assemble less but bigger lead balls , ...this way it would be possible to better concentrate the internal ballast closer to the nose and especially closer to the rear end , which is more important to enhance the casting performance .

But this would lead into having to shape the bait more voluminous , especially at the tail end , and it also takes a planful proccesss about determining the thickness of the PVC body tapers fore and aft at the level of either end of the internal ballast groove inside of the Lexan core , .......you do not want to become too thin there .

So I guess , that I may still use . 22cal pellets instead of these .177cal , ...but not go any larger with the ballast balls .

Problem is , that these .22cal round pellets are very hard to find , did some googling in the internet , ....the greatest German manufacturer for airgun ammo has quit on making them , ......only a Spanish firm still produces and offers them , as it seems .

Still have a few hundred , though , ...I should just quit on shooting them with my slingshots :lol: !

Another problems is , that I did not have a matching straw at hand for .22cal , .......next time I'm going to Hamburg , I'd visit MacDonald or BurgerKing to loot some of their straws there :lol: , ...those are bigger in diameter , if my memory serves me right , ........but I would also look around local shops , straws don't cost a fortune !

Also I still have some round curtain weight chunks of lead , approx . 5 x 10 mm in size , ....these may be used as well , but only for deep divers with big lips , that cause the lures nose to dig down under a steeper angle , so that these cylindrical weights would still slide down the lure's nose reliably , as they provide a lot more friction to the straw liner compared to round balls .

Vic , this is my hobby routing machine , ......I have an older model , though , but basically it's the one .

Quite nice for wood and plastic materials , also aluminium is still possible , ...but all with moderate depth settings and feeds , as the motor is not that powerful , ...having an overheating safety switch , it would stop on overload , and one would have to unplug and wait for a minute or two .

I've been using it for about 15 years now , might not want to miss it :

http://www.haushaltw.../detail552.html

I have a machine vise mounted on the table , ........this machine is just fine for shaping different headplanes onto lathe-turned plugs , cutting accurately angular lipslots , planing down lureblanks to required thickness , furnishing accurate separation cuts on multi-sectioned lures , working on aluminium casting molds , .... etc ........so glad , that I have it , ........not suited for mass production , though , ...but just fine for tinkering .

Here are similar router bits to the one , that I've used(the cylindrical ones) :

http://www.conrad.de...FB.EPS_1000.jpg

But I also have heaps of industrial router bits similar to the ones on picture below , gathered from the scrapyard of my work , ........some of these are still perfect , just rejects due to little flaws , ...one plant of the company I'm working for , also makes these:

http://de.wikipedia....20080404134340

I can only use them up to 13mm dia. otherwise they won't fit into the chuck of the motor.

Thanks again , folks , ...greetz , Dieter :yay:

Edited by diemai

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Thank you Dieter for sharing your secrets. I knew if I was to have any chance of making such precise cuts I need something better than my hand held dremel tool. Now I know what is missing in my shop. That last set of bits look like they would make some excellent ballast bores too. Amazing work my friend thank you again!!

Vic

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Thanks again , folks :worship: , ..........a little update , .......got myself some XXL straws at a Hamburg Euro(Dollar)-store today , these are 8mm in diameter !

Still have some 250 rounds slingshot ammo down the workshop , ,.......7mm lead balls from a local Hamburg gun store , .......these match perfectly .

Guess that with these I can construct such lures even more effective in terms of further casting , as more weight can be concentrated in the rear of a lurebody with those bigger balls , ..........only have to make the lexan core about 2mm wider as with this first prototype , therefore make nose and tail a little less tapered , ...but it's gonna be OK , I reckon .

..........to be continued , ............greetz , Dieter :yay:

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Dieter,

I have been wondering how those larger ballast balls are going to effect the action of the next lure. :? It will be interesting to see the two baits swimming side by side. I suspect the big ball bait will have a wider swagger 8O I guess we will just have to wait and see. :mellow:

Vic

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Wow man that is absolutely amazing! Nice work.

Simple question (BRAND NEW TO THIS) is that just regualr PVC pipe that you would get at like a Home Depot or Lowe's?

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@ littleriver

VIc , ...I haven't had the swimming action on my mind , ...not yet , but the casting performance alone ,........by next week I should be able to launch another one with those bigger weights inside .

@ baitern

Check out more PVC topics in here , it would provide more info and sources , ......can't tell any sources , 'cause I'm located in Germany .

It is not PVC pipe , but some kinda hard foam , also known as PVC decking or trim board , .......a major manufacturer in the US is this one :

http://www.azek.com/

My own stuff is refrigerator insulation material sold in scrap pieces by a guy on a German site , .......this material is well suited for smaller to medium sized crankbaits and multiple jointed swimbaits , ...extremely buoyant(different densities available , I suppose) , works down very easy and has the advantage of not being vulnerable to water sepage like timber does .

Greetz , Dieter :yay:

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Hi there , folks ,

.............the latest update on my recent lure experiments :

Not quite satisfied with the casting performance that these cal.177 lead pellets do generate , .......I had expected a bit more of a better casting performance .

But as said in the video , .......I'm already working on another model of about same length , but sporting a bit more voluminous body , ......this one has an 8mm straw inside to be filled with 7mm leadballs .

This way more weight can be concentrated in a shorter portion of the straw liner(namely the rear part) , which should enhance the casting performance .

Guess , I'd have that one glued together for another test next weekend .

I know that this design is bound to function , .....last year I've made two other , smaller PVC lures with shifting internal weights(weights slide inside of internal lengthwise bores) , and these really cast pretty well , much better than comparably sized "ordinary" lures .

http://www.tackleunderground.com/community/gallery/image/8040-more-pvc-crankbaits/

Thanks for your interest , .......greetz , Dieter :yay:

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Nice video.

Do you think using smaller trebles might cut down on what you called the tumbling action on the cast?

I've found that I have to vary the amount of let down, the line between the rod tip and the lure, depending on which lure and rod I'm using, to avoid tumbling with some lures, especially the longer ones.

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Nice video.

Do you think using smaller trebles might cut down on what you called the tumbling action on the cast?

I've found that I have to vary the amount of let down, the line between the rod tip and the lure, depending on which lure and rod I'm using, to avoid tumbling with some lures, especially the longer ones.

Don't think so , Mark , .......and how about the hook-up rate with smaller trebles ?

I've learned about pike lures(in particular casting spoons, though) , that the distance between the single treble points should be about as wide as the width of the lure , not smaller , .........and that's what they are on my prototype .

The amount of line between rod tip and lure is something , that I haven't taken into consideration yet , ...thanks for pointing out , .......but one thing , I must say , is that spinning gear is not the best for casting longer and heavier crankbaits , .......they get to tumble and spin around easier and also the trebles are more likely to catch up with the line or leader .

A casting rod and reel might do better with such lures , .......but still I'm using a spinning rod as it is more versatile .

Most likely fishing from the bank , I can only take one rod along and this spinning rod in the video handles 1/4 ounce small trout spoons , 3/4 ounce leadheads rigged with plastic shads and also 1 3/4 ounce crank, -or glidebaits , .........and I do not have to bother about windy conditions , which are a pain in the butt for casting gear and ligther lures IMO .

Gonna see , what the next prototype with 7mm lead ball weights would do , ........thanks anyway , Mark , ....greetz , Dieter :yay:

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A little update :

This morning I have balanced my second prototype , equipped with a 8mm straw liner .

The length is the same to the first one , but the belly is a bit deeper and also the tail end a bit higher , ........due to the higher , therefore less tapered tail end , I was able to lead the inner groove further down the tail end , which naturally allows the lead balls to roll further down as well , ....providing the center of gravity to also move down the tail further on a cast .

I had at first tried to place seven leadballs 7mm dia. into the straw liner , but in the waterbucket I've found , that this was way too much , the lureblank hung almost vertically , only the nose tip and diving bill stuck out of the water's surface .

I want the lure to have some buoancy left to pop off underwater obstacles reasonably fast , also I was concerned , whether the diving bill would catch up with the water to level the lure to correct position , once the retrieve commences .

So I made a new straw liner containing only five 7mm leadballs and , ......voila , .......the swimming position came to look very promising !

With the weights down the tail the lure hangs quite a bit more tail down compared to the first prototype holding twelve cal.177 balls in a 6mm straw liner , ......when the balls slide into the nose , it also hangs more head down to enhance the diving performance .

And one more important thing is , that the five 7mm balls fill up only about 2/5's of the entire liner's length , whereas the twelve cal.177 balls use a bit more than half of the 6mm straw's length , ...so the center of gravity switches over better and more pronounced with the fewer but bigger leadballs .

Gonna glue this second prototype together tomorrow morning prior to lateshift and take it to fishing pond coming weekend for a test video again , ........I'm quite sure , that it would perform better than the first one .

Thanks a lot for your interest , .......greetz , Dieter :yay:

Edited by diemai

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Hi there , folks ,

Tested the second prototype this morning , ......sadly I kinda messed up when glueing the lexan core into the PVC body , .......too much glue inside of the acommodating groove caused the thin ridge on top of the liner groove of the lexan core to bend inward , ........thus squeezing the internal straw liner a bit leading to the final result , that the 7mm lead balls would often bind in about center of the liner and not slide back and forth properly anymore .

I was not aware of this before , as with the first prototype the cal.177 leadballs did have a lot more space inside of even the thinner straw liner that I had fitted into that one , .........surely same thing had happened there as well , but due to the balls being a lot smaller than the liner's inner diameter it just was not noticeable !

Well , live and learn , .......I'm getting to even all the bugs out , I guess , ......this new lure also does not turn out an entire reject , I've only failed on the proper intended function again , .......undoubtely it might still catch fish this way , though !

Thanks a lot for your interest and patience , .......greetz , diemai :yay:

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Thank you for sharing Dieter.

Looks promising.. It is hard to tell with the video but I was wondering how the placement of the balls affected the action? Slower, faster , wider, narrower or what when the balls where in front and back. Looked to be faster and wider when in front but could not be sure. Hoping you could share some insight.

Thanks again. :worship: Great Job!! :yay:

Vic

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@ littleriver

I haven't even thought about that yet , Vic , .......the balls are supposed to hang in the nose on retrieve , but due to the inner liners failure on this lure different options of balance do occur now .

Certainly with differently positioned leadballs subtle differences in the swimming action would show up , ...but I'd have to check this more closely in the bath tub , .....at least doing that video I did not figure out about any differences , but surely they would be there .

Gotta do such indoor video next week , would really be interesting to see , ........at least that little flaw would have a teaching effect this way :lol: !

Here is my latest test with two new models , done yesterday . The small one turned out rather disappointing , ...also did not position the line tie properly , still requires some more tinkering .

But to my surprise the deep diver worked out pretty well(you know , my goal of design is furthest possible casting) , .......though it is not that hard to designing big lipped and far-casting deep divers EVEN WITHOUT shifting weights , ......the big lip always acts like a kinda guiding rudder on flight often letting the lure dart its way like an arrow , a little more voluminous rear body portion with sufficient ballast inside also does its share .

Presently I'm still working on a 4" minnow shaped weightshifter , ...all in all I'm a bit dissapointed so far about the options of this design of a Lexan core with a PVC body , .........but maybe this 4" bait to be tested next weekend would change my mind .

Thanks again for your interest , ...greetz , Dieter :yay:

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They both looked pretty good to me. I like that slow wide action on the little one. She needs a streamer on the back. Might try attaching a curly tail grub to the rear hook using a single hook with curly tail grub instead of the treble. Like one of Huberts lures. I think his curly tail is built in. I am thinking it will slow the action a bit and allow for a faster retrieve without blowout. The trick will be to find the right grub trailer. :? You have the perfect lure. 8O

Thank you for sharing. :worship: Always enjoy the videos. :yay:

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Great action on that small lure. I love that big wobble. Did you consider boring a hole for the ball bearings instead of using the straw? Congratulations on a successful lure. Musky Glenn

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