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A Couple Questions On Building A Hunting Crank
127 replies to this topic
Posted 21 October 2012 - 10:40 AM
I painted my hunting prototype with Createx, probably 10 coats altogether, and then dipped it three times in my urethane topcoat.
When I fished it, it rolled. I had to add a suspend dot between the bill and the belly hanger to get it to swim and hunt again.
So, evidently, my paint and topcoat adds buoyancy, enough so that I will add more front ballast in my next one to allow for it.
Posted 07 June 2013 - 08:40 PM
Bumpmaster BTH strikes again!! I have been tinkering with smaller crankbaits than I usually build (1/2 oz and less size as opposed to my usual fat boy 3/4 oz and up sizes...) and have made a few (a very few...) that have what I would call a "hunting" action. I haven't used moveable ballast or funky bill shaving techniques to do it but for me, bill shape/angle and ballast placement are the keys to getting a bait to hunt. I had tried my hand at reproducing a Waddle Bat with limited success but have gone away from thise for now. I may revisit the concept later but crankbaits have been made that hunt without the rear blade so I know it can be done... Like Ben, I don't want someone to hand over hard won knowledge for free as I wouldn't feel like I had actually accomplished anything but if anyone reading this has any insights on whether I'm on the right track I would appreciate them saying so!
Posted 08 June 2013 - 01:21 AM
I wish I could say I'd figured out how to consistently build a lure that hunts, but sadly I can't. Thought I was on to something a time or two, and have gotten a couple of baits to act weird, but nothing I'd call a true hunting action. There were multiple baits built with different sizes of lips and lip angles, slightly different line tie locations. ballast placement, etc. Ballast location is one thing that was experimented with quite a bit. It was moved forward and backward as well as being placed farther up into the center of the bait close to the horizontal axis. Ballast was even placed in the top of a few baits in addition to the bottom hoping to create just enough of an imbalance that it would start the action I was looking for. So far nothing I could call a true hunting action has been accomplished.
I experimented with this for a couple weeks at a time on several different occasions before finally getting aggravated enough to put it on the back burner until the "agony of defeat" wears off. Being as hardheaded as I am there will definitely be more experiments on this subject. I just have to give myself a cooling down period every now and then before going back to work on something that has so far gotten the best of me.
Right now the best I can do is wish you good luck.
Posted 08 June 2013 - 02:13 AM
Love this topic.
I made a batch of small flat sided baits a while back, to find out my success rate. I managed 9 out of 10 hunting and I know what I did wrong on the failure too.
Stick with it, you will kick yourself when you discover the secret
Posted 08 June 2013 - 07:38 AM
The more I play with this the more I feel like the belly weight has more to do with it than the bill but I suppose its all tied together.... Like spinning plates... Everything depends on everything else being just so or you don't get what you want....
Posted 08 June 2013 - 09:46 AM
Found this picture in a search for Fred Young Big O's... This guy auctioned off three he owned and the pictures he posted are very helpful... To me, at least... Especially the bottom right.
Edited by bluetickhound, 08 June 2013 - 09:49 AM.
Posted 08 June 2013 - 10:28 AM
For what it's worth- the new Bagley balsa B's (b1) will hunt at higher speeds right out of the package. I've been buying a lot of different American & Japanese squarebills lately. From my observations, the ones that hunt have a few things in common I've found:
- they weigh less than 1/2oz
- the line tie is right on top of the bill, touching it(see the new b1).
- they have a skinny little 'tail' (as in the back is tapered sharply).
Whether these attributes help make them hunt I don't know, but they all have these 3 things in common.
An interesting take on hunting cranks is another crank by Imakatsu(those guys are seriously innovative), called the scare brow. It's a crank with 2 knots on its forehead like a furoughed brow. It makes subtle tics to the left & right. Like other hunting cranks, the smaller size version (the 48) has a better action. It's a cool little crank that catches fish.
I have a little megabass sr-x quiet griffon that I tweaked and torqued on the line tie & split ring, and whatever I did... It'll run straight at normal speeds but speed it up and it'll come up and jump right outta the water (and not in a sloppy, blown out way). It's the damnedest thing I've ever seen, and it looks good/triggers strikes lol. Should be effective when throwing into schooling bass chasing shad
Posted 08 June 2013 - 10:40 AM
A hunting flatside crank, that's cool! I've never seen or heard of that, how about posting up some photos or a little video of it swimming whenever you get a chance, I'd like to see that.
Posted 08 June 2013 - 10:45 AM
That's cool! Do you know exactly what you did or is it one of those "happy accidents" that couldn't be duplicated if you tried it a hundred times?
Posted 08 June 2013 - 12:21 PM
It was an accident, it started running to the left so I got to bending on the line line tie to straighten it, accidently bending the split ring end straight in the process(as seen in the pic). I don't know if that straight split ring end is what causes it or not. i'll try it on another bait
Posted 09 June 2013 - 06:34 AM
Will do. Give me a few days, need to get water permission as my tank is decommissioned with rot.
Posted 09 June 2013 - 11:25 AM
If you're looking for a golden BB solution for a hunting bait, I don't think one exists. You need to consider the whole bait: the body shape, the lip shape and size, and the amount and position of the ballast, and getting it to work takes trial and error. I've built series of baits that were mostly hunters. The problem I ran into was that while 70% would hunt, I would also get 20% that would not and 10% that were untunable trash can rejects. And I felt that was a decent success rate compared to most of the bait lines I've fished. My general approach was to build a crank that is on the edge of instability, but not so near the edge that it will blow out or plane off at high speed. Once I got there, frankly I backed off the gas because the 20% that wouldn't hunt and especially the 10% that were total rejects made it a frustrating exercise. I don't water test each and every bait that I give away, so I didn't want to be handing out those 10% duds. And honestly, it took a lot of discipline to build them - maybe more discipline than I want to exercise as a hobby builder.
I'm happy if serendipity strikes and I get an occasional hunter, in shallow bait models. But on most baits I'm more interested in the pulse action (thump) I feel when retrieving the bait. If it's very distinct and regular, I'm happy. Maybe it's just my personal bias but I think you can tell blindfolded whether a bait will catch fish, catch lots of fish, or mostly be ignored by bass - by educating your hands on the retrieve feel of different baits.
Posted 15 June 2013 - 10:53 AM
As promised, here is a short video. No big production, straight out of the can.
Posted 16 June 2013 - 02:32 AM
Hey Dave....What's it going to cost for you to tell everyone how to build a crankbait that will hunt. I don't build baits myself, but you could save everyone a lot of time and trouble and may be a marriage or two. I know that everyone looks up to you because of your skills and talents. Not to mention that your a all around great guy.
By the way great job on the bait and video.
take care, Brent
Posted 16 June 2013 - 03:48 AM
Posted 16 June 2013 - 04:13 AM
It is kind of an unwritten rule that you don't give the hunting theory away. Believe me, I would love to and anyone who has followed my posts will know that I love to share.
Everyone who builds lures has come across the 'hunting' phenomenom. It is there for everyone to grab and not far away from your normal builds. The secret of building consistent hunters, is understanding what causes the hunt. Once you understand the cause, it is easy to design a lure to hunt.
Any crankbait body design can be made to hunt. The reason I built this flat sided crank was that someone said that flats do not hunt.
This particular lure is Bawal 7, a predecessor to Bawal 12, for which I posted a construction video. Don't waste your time copying it, like I said, any crank body design will hunt, it has nothing to do with body shape.
Posted 16 June 2013 - 05:46 PM
Thanks for sharing this little clip , Dave , ........a very picturesque demonstration of the hunting action .
I had assumed , that it would be like this , but now I know for sure !
greetz , Dieter
Posted 17 June 2013 - 09:20 AM
Is it ballast placement?