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Top Coat Question
13 replies to this topic
Posted 09 July 2004 - 07:15 PM
I have alot of confidence with Lucky Craft products, however, the finish on these baits does not last very long. Is it possible for me to top coat them after I buy them and not mess up the action of the baits?
Posted 09 July 2004 - 08:34 PM
You are taking a risk by doing so. I have modified the paint on some of my wiggle warts for steelhead fishing and finished them with Devcon. I found that some of them would no longer run!! Bummer. Lucky craft baits are beautiful and I would be very hesitant to change much about them. Although some guys here spray Etex I think most brush this product on, it's quite thick when used in this way. Devcon is the same, quite thick when brushed which adds to liklihood of causing problems with the action. If you are going to give this a try look at a spray on coat of some type, there are many versions at any hardware store. Make sure you get something that won't yellow the baits. I am not comfortable enough with telling you which product to use, someone here much more experienced in this regard will chime in soon Im' sure. Good luck!
Posted 09 July 2004 - 10:33 PM
There are clearcoats that you can spray, but they are not that tough either. If you get a bait that starts to loose its clearcoat, they you could try either urathane clear or a product called dura cryl. The urathane clear will spray through the airbrush just fine. It is crystal clear and very light. BlackJack has mentioned dura cryl. It sounds like it is similar. The only problem with this stuff is that if you fish were there is alot of rock or have to go to the plug knocker often the finish will chip. But it is easy enough to spray another coat on if this happens. You won't have to strip off the previous coat to respray. Scratches and divots will dissappear with a coat or two over them.
Posted 11 July 2004 - 10:41 AM
It is a trade off between: durability versus ease in application.
The spray finishes that are now in use most likely are not as tough as the devcon epoxy and will be prone to chip more so than the epoxy. However, the durability of the majority of automotive spray finishes are dependent on what is used beneath the clear-coat. Many of the urethane, polyurethane and high solid clears on the market today require a certain base-coat to ensure durability and if applied over the correct base-coat will give you a reliable finish as what is seen on today's vehicles. But if you are using different base-coats such as water base paint,
lacquer or some enamels then clear-coating with a urethane product the integrity of the finished product will be compromised and of a lesser quality than when adheres to the manufacturer's recommendations
The duracryl that Skeeter mentioned is a clear lacquer product easy to use and correct mistakes, works good on lures, but again not as tough as epoxy. Something to think about, test the cleacoat that you have decided to use on a small area of the lure before spraying or brushing finishing the entire bait to see if there is a compatibility issue or you might have a wrinkled mess, but then again, that might be what the fish are looking for! Good Luck!
Posted 11 July 2004 - 07:50 PM
Are you saying that if I use Urathane Lacquers, that the Urathane clear may hold up better and actually be harder because of this?
Posted 11 July 2004 - 11:28 PM
I wasn't aware of urethane lacquer, that is news to me and I know nothing about it. The duracryl I have used is automotive acrylic lacquer, produced by ppg. Most of the urethanes and polys are base-coat/ clear-coat systems. The base-coat is designed to be clear-coated with a urethane or poly clear to achieve optimal performance from the finish. The better the clear adheres to the base-coat the more resistant to chipping the clear-coat will be. The same applies to the acrylic lacquers.... clear lacquer is designed for application over acrylic lacquer colors or spot repairs over catylized enamels. It may lay down over another basecoat such as water-base paint and look good but durabillity will be sacrificed. Differences in expansion coefficents start to come into play; one expands at a greater rate than the other over time the weaker fails and peeling occurs. No, the clear finish doesn't gain hardness it just sticks better!
Posted 12 July 2004 - 11:12 PM
I see. I was using acrylic lacquer and then using urathane clear for the clearcoat. The baits looked so beautiful. The clear just couldn't take the rocks and plug knocker without chipping. Thought maybe I was doing something wrong. Thanks.
Posted 14 July 2004 - 01:30 PM
Ppg made a product years ago called Delclear it is a clear urethane which would go over lacquer. Don't think it is made anymore. Most likely that nason clear is not intended for use over lacquer, check the can label. Nason-(inexpensive paint line) paint was used by Maaco for years, I am confident Dupont's version is much better.
Posted 14 July 2004 - 10:57 PM
Allot of guys down here use to use Dura-Cryl. It was made by BASF. But it had lead in it and the EPA killed the stuff 2yrs. ago. Do you know if this was a lacquer clear? Do you think that a lacquer clear would work better and maybe be less chip resistant? Do you have any suggestions?
Posted 15 July 2004 - 10:51 PM
I have used a few basf products but, I don't recall ever using Dura-cryl.
If you have been using epoxy, I don't think lacquer as a clear-coat will ever perform up to your expectations. There are better products (more durable) out there, but, they come with a price. You will have to use the recommended products from the primer up to the clear-coat to acheive the best that can be. I don't know what your situation is in regards to how many baits you make at a time or how often you make them. The majority of these products have limited shelf life once they air hits them they go bad quickly. This can be costly and one will incur significant waste, if their operation is not geared for production. In my situation, I am not refinishing baits for sale so I use lacquer, the same thinner goes in the primer, color, and clear, and on occasion, a splash of retarder to slick them out....easy, but not the most resiliant finish available. One of the toughest spray finishes that I am aware of is Dupont's Imron, has been around for years and is a reliable product. I would further investigate the urethane lacquer or check some of the custom paint maker's: House of Kolor, Metalflake; they still might make urethane clears that are compatible with lacquers.
Posted 15 July 2004 - 11:25 PM
With the price that I charge for my baits, I cannot take the chance of a customer getting anything but the best clearcoat there is. I am of the opinion that epoxy is the toughest clearcoat there is. I have to apply it to the baits by hand and bait by bait, but it is the best way to go for me. I got into these other clearcoats because it is what some of the big custom crankbait makers use around these parts. It allows them a faster turn around time on a bait if they can spray multiple baits with clearcoat at one time. But none of these clears holds a candle to epoxy. I'll stick with what I know. I have done enough experimenting. Thanks for the help and information.
Posted 19 July 2004 - 12:36 PM
Your welcome, I understand that, trial and error can be expensive with no better results.