Mcleod Posted February 25, 2015 Report Share Posted February 25, 2015 Interesting that it is an improved formula, I would guess that mine is the newer formula given that was three years ago. As for the products, same as salty, KBS Diamond Clear and their #1 thinner. Angus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
top dawg custom baits Posted February 27, 2015 Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 HI everyone, I would like to say thanks for all the info you guys share this site has made it fun to learn and try new things. my question is I am thinking about ordering some kbs do I need to use bloxygen along with the #1 thinner. and for those of you using it. what is the shelf life of this product compared to dick nite . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathan Posted February 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 Top Dawg, From what I understand (I haven't used it personally) It doesn't "go off" near as fast as DN...Guys are dipping it and getting months out of a can..When it starts to thicken a bit they add thinner...Nathan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saltshaker Posted February 27, 2015 Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 top dawg, I wouldn't waste money on the bloxygen, but, the thinner is almost a must. You can use common lacquer thinner to clean/soak your brush or clean your airbrush, but, I wouldn't use it for thinning. I did thin it once with lacquer thinner before I knew about the recommended #1 thinner. Honestly, I could not see any difference, But..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted February 27, 2015 Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 top dawg, I wouldn't waste money on the bloxygen, but, the thinner is almost a must. You can use common lacquer thinner to clean/soak your brush or clean your airbrush, but, I wouldn't use it for thinning. I did thin it once with lacquer thinner before I knew about the recommended #1 thinner. Honestly, I could not see any difference, But..... Has anyone read the safety data sheet on the #1 thinner? It should tell you what's in it. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
21xdc Posted February 27, 2015 Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 KBS told me to use Xylene/Xylol as it flash's off slower and mix's well with their product. They talked me out of using their #1 thinner... I have had no trouble over any type of paint or photo finish's I do... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
top dawg custom baits Posted February 27, 2015 Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 thanks for the advice everyone !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saltshaker Posted February 27, 2015 Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 Well, I guess I'm just a sucker they made a pitch to sell the thinner to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathan Posted February 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 21xdc..What was the reason they talked you out of the thinner?...Nathan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ichthus Posted February 27, 2015 Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 I think when I get it, I'll use laquer thinner since that's what's on hand for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
21xdc Posted February 28, 2015 Report Share Posted February 28, 2015 They don't market their product for fishing lures... The thinner they sell may work better for their bulk sales. For my specific application, I was told to buy Zylene/Zylol to slow the cure down and reduce bubbles. They said that they have a guy that makes custom pool sticks and uses this combo with awesome results... I bought a qt of Zylene for $10 or less local. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathan Posted February 28, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 28, 2015 21xdc..Thanks..Nathan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
21xdc Posted February 28, 2015 Report Share Posted February 28, 2015 I just dipped 6 baits 3 times each in 8 hrs and no bubbles. Dip, let drip until drips are 10 seconds apart, put on turner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saltshaker Posted March 1, 2015 Report Share Posted March 1, 2015 21xdc, you turn your lures after dipping? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
21xdc Posted March 1, 2015 Report Share Posted March 1, 2015 Yep... I want an even coat. No better way in my opinion. No pooling in eye sockets etc. Some baits have crevices that clear can settle in. Turning eliminates any chance of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spoonpluggergino Posted March 1, 2015 Report Share Posted March 1, 2015 I have been following this thread due to I am interested in dipping and turning a bait vice mixing e-tex or some other epoxy product. I see that some people having problem with air bubbles or bubbles, I wonder if the problem is due to maybe the bait not being sealed properly. The reason I am saying this is because when I first started making and clear coating baits I had a terrible time with air bubbles and I finally figured out the problem, at least with my baits, the problem was that I was not doing a good job on sealing my baits. I am going to try KBS Diamond clear when I run out of e-tex and Devcon2 ton, I love the idea to just dip, let it drip than turn, my two cents Gino Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted March 1, 2015 Report Share Posted March 1, 2015 Gino, I've had the most problem with bubbles in MCU when I dipped and put the baits on a lure turner. I solved it by just dipping and hanging them up so any excess MCU dripped off the tail. Along with others, I think the bubbling problem is caused when the MCU begins to cure and expels CO2. If the coating is too thick, the CO2 can't escape the surface of the MCU before it begins to skin over, which happens very quickly. I don't know what to make of the opinions here on TU that KBS is "friendlier" because you can dip baits in it without the stuff beginning to cure in the can. I've tried several brands of MCU and they all had that storage problem when used to dip lures - so I remain skeptical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saltshaker Posted March 2, 2015 Report Share Posted March 2, 2015 In response to Bob's comment on KBS..... I never meant to insinuate that KBS doesn't set up in the container because, as Bob pointed out, it's a moisture cure urethane and that's what they do. I can, without reservation, say that, of the MCU's that I've used, KBS is more user friendly in that it doesn't set up prematurely as quick as the others. I couldn't stand it....I bought a quart of Dick Nite back when it was solely the talk-of-the-town. I was shocked at how fast I lost that quart of finish. So then I tried a product called Garco thinking it couldn't possibly be as bad as DN. I don't know that I got 20 lures finished before the stuff stiffened in the jar. In just a matter of a day or so after I noticed it...it was solid in the container. I basically swore off of MCU's after that and went back to my automotive finish....until I came across KBS. A buddy had already tried it and recommended it to me as "the real deal". I have found it to be just that. It will set up in the container, but, not nearly at the rate of the others. I'm thoroughly convinced of that because I've given it every opportunity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
21xdc Posted March 2, 2015 Report Share Posted March 2, 2015 Thinning with Xylene 10% slows down the curing and lets the bait breath before it skins over... No need for being skeptical. I don't sell the KBS, I use it.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saltshaker Posted March 2, 2015 Report Share Posted March 2, 2015 I have yet to receive my free quart for advertisement. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
top dawg custom baits Posted March 2, 2015 Report Share Posted March 2, 2015 hey saltshaker and 21xdc this is my concern with trying a mcu is the shelf life. I know mcu will harden in the container do you think it will last for a 3 to 6 month period before setting up. I plan on putting it in a canning jar for dipping mixed with 10 % to 15 % thinner. thanks joe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
21xdc Posted March 2, 2015 Report Share Posted March 2, 2015 I just started dipping some baits and have been opening the can a lot more than usual. I may start using bloxygen. I have been brushing my baits as they mostly have been jointed. Bloxygen can also be replaced with "wine preserver" such as private preserve or similar... It's just inert gas and can probably be found locally for most cheaper and no shipping. I have not seen any thickening yet. I suggest that if your really interested, Please read all 56 reviews on the KBS web site. Many lure builders on there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted March 2, 2015 Report Share Posted March 2, 2015 (edited) Joe, I think if you're careful about handling and storage, a quart can of DN, and probably KBS, will last more than 6 months. When I dipped in DN, a quart lasted about 8 months in salsa jars with restricted neck and spraying Bloxygen finish preserver in the jar after each use. That was without adding any thinner to the jar. It also matters how you dip baits - a quick dip and then letting the excess drip off onto a newspaper and not back into the jar is a good thing. Ambient humidity is also a factor, which we usually can't control. Another factor is how often and how many baits you topcoat. I was building batches of 4-6 baits every two weeks, dipping once, and eventually lost about half of my DN. The sooner you use it, the better. But a quart of MCU lasts a long time since it yields a pretty thin coating. Bottom line is that while guys can tell you their experience with MCU, your experience will vary depending on exactly how you use and store it. 21XDC - I tried aerosol wine preserver on a quart of Garco MCU. The preserver was mostly CO2 and nitrogen and my MCU began to gel almost immediately. I came away feeling that Bloxygen (nitrogen + argon) worked and the wine preserver did not. Your mileage may differ, of course! Edited March 2, 2015 by BobP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
21xdc Posted March 2, 2015 Report Share Posted March 2, 2015 Good to know.. I have not bought either gas... I was told they have the same ingredients. I guess I was told wrong. But it does the same thing, blocking oxygen from getting to the wine with a layer of gas that is heavier than air. Maybe different wine preservers are different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
top dawg custom baits Posted March 2, 2015 Report Share Posted March 2, 2015 thanks for the help BOb.P and 21xdc I am going to order some I am just making sure I ask the questions before I do. I also know there is going to be a learning curve. I have tried epoxy's and concrete sealers I am using etex but looking for something that I can dip instead of brushing on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
