robalo01 Posted October 19, 2015 Report Share Posted October 19, 2015 This is the first one I have seen offered, but I wonder how long it will take for this to take off... http://www.ebay.com/itm/3d-printed-worm-craw-fish-mold-/272016700332?hash=item3f557573ac:g:hQQAAOSwwbdWHtxC I would be interested in printing a mold and them copying it in a more durable/heat resistant material. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walking Dead Posted October 19, 2015 Report Share Posted October 19, 2015 What do you think this one is made of? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robalo01 Posted October 19, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 19, 2015 (edited) Well, I assume it is ABS plastic that is heated and extruded, so I would think it would break down with heat over time. Maybe not. I also know it takes alot of time and is somewhoat expensive to be done repeatedly. You can make an RTV mold and copy it with epoxy resin. That would last longer and be cheaper in the long run, in my experience. Might need a mold release. Edited October 19, 2015 by robalo01 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNC Molds N Stuff Posted October 19, 2015 Report Share Posted October 19, 2015 One advantage to printed molds (for soft plastics) is that you may be able make them with features that could not be easily machined using subtractive machining. The most common plastic printing is with ABS, but there are other plastics available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cajunlures Posted October 19, 2015 Report Share Posted October 19, 2015 I have recently dabbled in this concept. I have been able to utilize 3D printing very successfully. I've only done a few single cavity molds. But now looking to increase the cavities per mold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishon-son Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 this looks some what machined? i see cutter lines Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishon-son Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 looks like a few european molds ive seen on line..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 The problems with this technology for making molds; are the time to print and the surface finish. The mold that I am working on, which is a 2 cavity bluegill, I am told takes close to 24 hours to print. This fact alone means that you are not going to be hitting the mass production market. The surface finish is never going to be smooth, due to the layering method used to build the RP print. Dave 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basseducer Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Why not ask the seller some questions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 A better solution would be to print a symmetrical Mother mold. With this, I will be able to pour RTV and both halves of the mold will be interchangeable. I can either produce enough RTV molds for mass production or sell the RTV molds or sell the Mother for a very high price or sell the computer model for an even higher price. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gekhang Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Been working with a few myself and it has been working great. i make a master mold and cast it in silicone, bondo or two part putty. Have made a few jig heads and a bunch of soft plastic molds. Here's a recent ice fishing one i made. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Gekhang - Ha! I just bought 4Kg of a Bondo equivalent, an hour ago. I have just been researching the hardener ratio by weight (50:1) and whether the bondo sticks to ABS (no). I will still probably use a release agent, like Pam. Also I am going to thin the filler with fiberglass resin, to achieve a pourable liquid. I read that the best ratio is 4:1 filler to resin. If you have any comments on the above from your experience, let me know. Good job on the mold. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gekhang Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 definitely needs release agent. i would also suggest brushing on the bondo first before pouring it in. that way you eliminate as many bubbles as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Gekhang - Oh yes, most definitely needs a release agent. I did a 50g dry test and it is welded solid. I will try a 50g cooking oil test tomorrow. I guess the rough surface texture of the RP print is the big problem. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 Gekhang - the cooking oil test kind of worked, but the test piece still stuck a little bit and had to be popped off with a screw driver. Not good enough. What are you using for a release agent? I have changed my Mother mold design, so that the box sidewall is a separate part and can be released easily. This will make the base plate more accessible. I am thinking a few taps through a wood block should release the plate. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNC Molds N Stuff Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 You could try PVA. Its pretty much the standard in plastics and polyesters for a mold release. Its also used for making silicone rubber parts if I recall. If you are planning to do soft plastics and need a mold release then I think worm oil is should work. If the printed mold is anything like the clear acrylic molds Jann's sells it won't handle to many heat cycles before it turns to muck anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 Bob - The RP plastic (ABS) is the Mother mold. From this I will be casting molds with a polyester Bondo filler type product. It is the Bondo that I need to release from the ABS. My original intention with this project was to print both mold halves with a built in injector. However, the mating surfaces were poor and not as flat as I was expecting. The RP process was also unable to print the cylindrical void with any circular accuracy. This step of the development was abandoned. I too have doubts whether the ABS could take the continuous heat cycles. The idea of using Bondo, is that when heated up, it softens. The mold halves then can be clamped together to fix the mating surfaces. I will not be using regular plastisol, but a jello and glycerol mix which will pour at around 175F (80C). Because of the very slow cooling process (15 minutes), I will need lots of molds to put in the fridge. I considered plaster, but the mating surface would always be an issue, plus the cooling process would take longer. Demolding the plaster was problematic due to the complexity causing chipping. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yo Al Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 Dave- I would try a paste wax for a release agent. It works well for body filler and polyester resin. I think it might help even out the surface irregularities of the ABS too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 Yo Al - I agree, a wax will be the most effective solution, as I have used floor tile wax on both resin and filled resin in the past with great success. I am hoping to find a thinner solution to the problem, so that I can maintain the detail and particularly the mating surface. I will be using vacuum pouring method and any mating surface irregularities cannot be tolerated. Even the slightest air leak is disastrous to the pour. Ideally RTV would be the best solution by far, but it is expensive and I cannot find it locally. I have high hopes for Pam spray combined with my new prototype design. If this fails, it will be the wax for sure. As for the surface texture; I have done water visibility tests and the texture is almost invisible. As these lures are for home use, at the most, local distribution with zero competition, the texture is of no concern. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRammit Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 As these lures are for home use, at the most, local distribution with zero competition, the texture is of no concern. Dave An unmolested lure market?... Id keep that detail under wraps, or else next thing you know, half the TU members move to Indonesia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 JR - I doubt it can be called a market, as fishermen just do not use artificial baits here. Even if they did, and possibly the reason why they never caught on, is that the prices are way too high for a guy who probably manages a family on $200 - $300 per month, in many cases a lot less. My aim is to generate local interest and take it from there. By having my test tank on the main road, I developed a lot of interest with the hard baits. People still stop me in the street and ask when I am going to start up again. Many of them I do not ever recall meeting before, so the word of mouth thing works particularly well when you are a giant, white, bald guy in this community. If I can take a new type of bait around the competition ponds and beat the locals, word would spread like wild fire. These ponds are fished by professionals, relying on their success as an income. Currently, $1 buys them enough bait for a 4 hour competition. They will be very reluctant to pay much more without a proven high success rate. Plus, if the bait was that good, it would more than likely be banned, as I have had baits and techniques banned before because of my success. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNC Molds N Stuff Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 PVA is thin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 Bob - do you mean; paint on the PVA glue and let dry? I can try that. I still have plenty of room for tests on a failed ABS mold. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNC Molds N Stuff Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 Glue? Maybe I have it wrong. I'll get back to you on that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 Good, 'cos the glue didn't work, it peeled off, even with the cooking oil. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
