eastman03 Posted February 18, 2016 Report Share Posted February 18, 2016 Hey guys. Long time reader, long time musky fisherman, but just getting into this lure building thing. I've read and watch countless forums and youtube videos in an attempt to learn from other guys' trials and errors. I just have a few questions (for starters). I'm attempting to copy a custom X crankbait and I cut a slot in the bottom to accept the wire harness. This was very tricky, and the result was not perfect. Is the best tool for this job a table saw? Hard to control the depth overall, and to get the exact center (which I ended up missing), or is there a better tool to use that I'm not thinking about? Also, to glue in the wire harness I was going to use gorilla glue, but what would fill in the gap made by the cut (but also strengthen the wood and bond it together)? Any advice or pointers are much welcome! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimP Posted February 18, 2016 Report Share Posted February 18, 2016 Eastman03: I'm no pro by a long shot but I'll give you my two cents worth to get the ball rolling. Others will chime in and you will get several opinions that are all valid. You then will pick and choose to fit your style and available tools. Do all of you drilling and slotting while the wooden lure blank is still in the rectangular shape then saw the shape and contour the body. Gorilla Glue is great stuff, but its going to foam out into the hook hangers and lip slot. Its not too bad to remove if you catch it just right in the cure process, show up late and its a mess. Also consider epoxy and maybe Bondo as final filler. Thin wooden splines sized to fit the wire slots and inserted at the time you apply whatever glue you decide to use are easy to trim and sand flush. Table saw with as thin a blade as you can find. You can also get very thin slotting saws for use with drill presses. Be careful and come up with a safe jig to hold everything while you body parts are a safe distance away. Have fun! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishon-son Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 (edited) nice job so far....id like to see it done....looks like some vise marks on the side.....if so try some felt in the jaws....i did a bass crank from balsa and im waiting for warm weather to paint i used hook hangers so im no help ......but ,I'm looking to do a muskie bait soon...check the how to section....im sure theres something there helpful Edited February 19, 2016 by fishon-son Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 I would drill holes and make twisted wire eyes. Much simpler and plenty strong enough. The holes can be angled if you are concerned about the depth. Glue depth between 1" and 1.25" is what I would use. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastman03 Posted February 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Awesome advice guys. I really appreciate it all! As far as filling slot with the wire, I will probably just try some epoxy then. Seems easier and better that way. And yes, I put it in a vise really light to hold it, big mistake. Never do that. I still have lots of sanding to do so I should be able to get rid of that. My next bait I will try drilling holes and slotting first for sure. That way you could line everything up around the existing center line. Vodkaman - I have no experience with the screw in hardware, and frankly it terrifies me. I want these lures to be crushed by a 50+ in muskie, I suppose screw hardware could withstand that? I'm just not sure. Also a concern for a trolling crankbait is the lack of ability to bend the hook hangers to tune the bait. All in all, I will keep posting updates and doing lots of reading on the site to gain knowledge. I haven't even looked into painting it yet, so that should be fun. Thanks guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 I don't buy the screws, I twist my own wire. Stay with what you are comfortable with, you can try other stuff out later. There are so many ways to skin this cat and none of them are wrong. Car body filler (Bondo) is good for filling slots, very easy to sand and shape compared to epoxy. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Try taping some stiff cardboard or thin wood strips to your vise jaws so they won't scar. I put a couple of layers of duct tape on mine, and it works, but eventually it gets cut up, so I add more over the top of the old tape. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrogAddict Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 (edited) Just remember, anything you use to fill in the slots will add weight. I just built a muskie jerkbait and had it perfectly weighted and used epoxy to seal up the ballast holes....now I have a slow sinker!! I recommend using a handsaw to cut the slot for the through wire. The key is to go slow and make sure you're hitting your line. Speaking of the center line. I recommend marking your center line when your piece of wood is still square (and your line ties, ballast holes and lip slot as well). You can use a number of techniques to get your center line. A marking square deal or just a pencil laying flat on a work surface may work as well. I prefer using a fine tip permanent marker so it won't completely disappear when I sand. Any line left will be covered by paint anyway. Dave is right however, making your own twisted hook hangers and drilling an over-sized hole, filling the hole with epoxy and embedding your hook hangers in the hole will be very strong. Unless I work with Balsa, I don't do through wire anymore. I think I use .51 wire but honestly, I don't pay attention, I just grab the thicker spool when building Muskie lures. Just watch a couple Paul Adams videos on YouTube and you'll see some of these techniques being used. Edited February 19, 2016 by FrogAddict Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 If you have the room, you can drill countersunk holes through the back of the bait, coat the inside with super glue (if it's wood), and then glue alum. can discs over the holes to trap air high in your lure and restore some of the buoyancy. I do that when I want to adjust buoyancy on my PVC lures, but I don't have to use the super glue to seal the inside of the holes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodieb8 Posted February 20, 2016 Report Share Posted February 20, 2016 hi we build a similar style. try drill and wire thru. also that style will need a form of ballast. if you choose s/s screws use 0.92. . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastman03 Posted February 20, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 20, 2016 Interesting guys, I like all the feedback. I purchased some carbody filler to fill in the slot, I will do it without any added weight or anything to see what the end result will be. If it needs buoyancy or weight, I will add after. This bait will kinda be an experiment for myself. I'm curious about those hook hangers that you guys twisted. Do you have a picture of it at all? My next bait I will try drilling through or doing hook hangers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastman03 Posted February 24, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 24, 2016 Ok, so here's where I'm at. On the first bait I made, I gorilla glued the lip and the wire harness into the slot. Wow, that stuff expands in such a small space. Bit of a mess indeed. So after cleaning that up, I attempted to use bondo to finish filling the slot. What a mess. I was expecting it to be a bit more liquid? I don't think I was able to get it into all the cracks and crevices. Hopefully this provides enough strength and fill, and hopefully I can make it look like a nice piece of wood again. Yikes. Might try something else next time. So, on the second bait that I was working on, it's already going much better. I drew a center line, made my slot before I sanded it down (much easier to hit center also). Got some thicker makrolon (3/16") for a larger bill. And glued that in. I did not glue in the wire harness yet. Also, this wire harness was formed much nicer. Practice helps a lot. Any tips as to where to go from here? My next bait will be wire thru (not slotted). Maybe I'll attempt to fill this second bait's slot with epoxy. Thanks guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted February 24, 2016 Report Share Posted February 24, 2016 With Bondo, the idea is to slap it on and ram it in, hard and fast. Sure, scrape excess off if you have time, but it is not important. Bondo sands down so nicely and quickly with a Dremel and a drum sander bit. As long as you apply too much, you will be able to sand down to a perfect profile. If you try to be tidy, you may be a bit short in one or two spots and then have to either live with the blemish or apply more filler. Dave 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastman03 Posted March 7, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2016 Really appreciate the ideas guys. I had trouble finding any type of epoxy that wasn't quick set like the gorilla glue epoxy. I tried it on a practice slot I cut in the wood and just like the Bondo i tried in the slot, it was a bit to thick to really pour into the slot. I think I need to break down and buy a better epoxy for filling the gap like West system? Next bait I attempt will be a drilled through for the wire, which I haven't tried yet. As for water sealing the bait, I have spar urethane and will dip it in when I make all my cuts/holes. Haven't got to the paint or epoxy stage yet. Would really love to just get an air brush and start playing around with that. Any suggestions there? Here's my progress. Just need to keep trying and hone my skills. Every time I go work on it I find I leave with more questions. This is the very first lure with bondo (the pink stuff) filling in the slot. Did pretty good actually, if I can find a bit better way of getting it in there. Strong and sandable at least. Sealed. Ready for test run for now. This is lure #2 with the epoxy I attempted to fill the slot in, and stopped about 1/4 the way done. I used regular gorilla glue to hold in the bill. Seemed to work very well. I'm looking at getting a disposable syringe to pump the epoxy into the slot. That would be ideal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishon-son Posted March 7, 2016 Report Share Posted March 7, 2016 thinking maybe use some wood to fill in the slot epoxy that in place..then sand it all down... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrogAddict Posted March 8, 2016 Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 Paul Adams uses a bit of paper or plastic to make a small "funnel" to apply his epoxy into small areas. I can't stress enough that you should check out his videos on YouTube. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted March 9, 2016 Report Share Posted March 9, 2016 Paul Adams uses a bit of paper or plastic to make a small "funnel" to apply his epoxy into small areas. I can't stress enough that you should check out his videos on YouTube. Think cake decorator, or grout bag, and you'll get the idea. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastman03 Posted March 9, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 9, 2016 Great videos that Paul Adams has. I think some sort of bag like that would work. Thanks guys. I will put some wood in there also. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishon-son Posted March 10, 2016 Report Share Posted March 10, 2016 when do you invite someone to hunt them gators with you....lol dam that fish is big 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barrybait Posted March 10, 2016 Report Share Posted March 10, 2016 I can't remember which video I saw it on but this looked like a great way to go. Cut your slot for the wire harness with your table saw and note the blade thickness. Buy or cut the same material in the blade thickness. They have 1/16, 3/32, and 1/8" x 1" x 36" Balsa and Basswood at the craft stores. When you epoxy your wire harness in, brush epoxy on the thin board and slide it in the slot. Don't worry about the part that sticks out it will sand down quick. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastman03 Posted March 15, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2016 Again, thanks for all the ideas. I ended up mixing some epoxy up in a plastic bag with the tip cut out so I could squirt it into wherever I needed. Cheap easy solution, awesome. Also, cut thin strips of the cedar and wedged them into the slot as well. Totally made it easier to sand, and less epoxy. This forum is a great resource! So I was working on a new one on saturday. Basically a perch bait design. About 12 inches of wood, with a 4 inch bill. If this bad boy runs true, should smash bottom in 30 feet of water. We use these regularly in the fall around LOTW with great success. Now if I can make them and not have to spend 100$ that would be even better. Just working on jimmy rigging a lure turner together and I can get into airbrushing. I suppose a test run will be in order first. I'm not sure if I will need lead, or if crankbaits even run straight. Any of you guys have trouble building cranks and getting them to run true? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastman03 Posted March 17, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2016 Well, here's where I sit now. The two baits are primed and ready to be tested which is nice because the ice is starting to come out here I'm Manitoba. The other bait I filled in the slot and it was aweful. Should be ok in long run but I gotta figure something better to do. And the third pic is a very primitive lure turner, still in concept stage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrogAddict Posted March 19, 2016 Report Share Posted March 19, 2016 I continue to have trouble getting cranks to run true but it's mostly because I'm always messing with my designs. If I stay with a traditional body shape and lip configuration and I focus on keeping the body symmetrical, I am usually pretty successful. Oh, and never underestimate how important it is to get the ballast in the right place for the action you want. I recently built a crank and put ballast in front of and behind the line tie and it had the best tight action I've ever built. I then put ballast in front of the line tie only on the next crank and that one had a super wide wobble. The point is, there are so many factors, it's really endless.....thank God! Just my two cents here, keep the lure turner as simple as possible. I run a rotisserie motor and I use the square rotisserie spit. For small lures I use forceps to hold onto the lure and simply tape the forceps to the spit. For larger muskie lures, I made another "spit" out of a wood dowel. I drilled holes in the dowel and ran a heavy gauge wire through the dowel so the lure can suspend several inches from the dowel. If this doesn't make sense, I can take some pictures for you. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastman03 Posted March 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 19, 2016 Yea I've been reading up on ballast weights and I've come to the conclusion that I will most likely have to do some experimenting to get these to run nicely. Not even sure what I'm looking for action wise, just straight trolling. Thanks for the advice! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted March 23, 2016 Report Share Posted March 23, 2016 Just as a general guideline, the lower in the lure the ballast, and therefore the center of gravity, the more stable it will be. I've also found that keeping the ballast as close to the belly hook hanger as I can gives my cranks the maximum side to side (Xing) movement. I think of the lure body, front to back, as the plank on a seesaw. The closer to the center pivot point, the faster the movement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
