eastman03 Posted March 24, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2016 I did some experimenting with the baits, weighing them with all the hardware and comparing them to the weights of other baits that I like similar size. And also tested them in water after smashing open some ice in the ditch haha. They floated on their side like I thought so ballast was required for sure. (PS I would kill for a xray shot of some of those musky lures, but I'm not going to be the one to band saw in half a 50-100$ lure!) So I added some weight as appropriate, not sure how the lure will run yet as we are still waiting for some open water to give it a test. I melted some lead in a big spoon that I used to make catfish weights with and poured it into holes drilled in the baits. That worked quite well actually. Epoxied those holes full, another sand and some primer. So I have three baits at the moment that are ready for open water test. At the moment I'm shopping for a airbrush. I bought a REAL cheap Princess auto brush (actually a beaver 200) which I know is going to be a complete letdown/failure/frustration. But at the moment it will do to play with. Hopefully getting a Badger patriot or something for fathers day?! A guy can hope. (PS Vodkaman, i left this screen open and my wife sat down at the computer and saw your tag line under your comments, brilliant. Too funny!) Anyway, that's where my progress has gotten me. I can stop posting updates if this is getting redundant. So I was bored today and made my first small batch of envirotex lite. Tried it out over the primer of one of the lures I made. Great looking stuff. My lure turner works great too. Might have laid it on a bit thick as i couldn't get some of the microbubbles out. Oh well, good test. See how it looks tomorrow. There are a million videos and forum topics on Envirotex help, need to read more of them. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted March 24, 2016 Report Share Posted March 24, 2016 I think you should continue with this thread, I think enough people are interested in your progress. Do a Google search 'lure x-ray' and select 'images', there are a lot of pics to look at. What you have done looks reasonable. Try a float test in a bucket of water. Dave 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRammit Posted March 24, 2016 Report Share Posted March 24, 2016 For the initial float test, scotch tape comes in handy... Just tape weights to the bottom, moving around until the lure floats how you want, then you know where to drill Also, you can make a quick mold for your weights by clamping 2 blocks of wood together and drilling down the crack.. Use the same size drill bit on the lure, guaranteed snug fit... Now you can float test before drilling holes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barrybait Posted March 24, 2016 Report Share Posted March 24, 2016 I'm not going to be the one to band saw in half a 50-100$ lure!) I was visiting a friend and seen two top water baits (lunker punkers) that had failed. Coating failed, wood split, wts all but falling out. I asked him how much he wanted for them and he said he was going to fix them. I laughed, said you better let me fix em. That's how I learned to weight top water punkers, wooden super spooks, etc. You may be able to fix a friends failed lure or buy one cheap at a garage sale that has failed and cracked and they think is no good anymore. It'll be plenty good enough to learn from. Barry 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastman03 Posted March 27, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2016 (edited) Well there's a first time for everything. Tried out the airbrush after setting up and it worked great. Took lots of time to clean it after because I hear that's the bugged concern. Anyway this was just a free handed trial, went pretty well! Can't wait to keep going. Get a few more colours and plan a better design. Still need to put some etex on it and see how it runs. Edited March 27, 2016 by eastman03 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimP Posted March 27, 2016 Report Share Posted March 27, 2016 Good going eastman03, that is the most impressive "first attempt" I have ever seen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishon-son Posted March 27, 2016 Report Share Posted March 27, 2016 looks real good Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastman03 Posted March 31, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 (edited) So went and checked out how the lures were doing after applying the first cost of envirotex. Not good. I guess beginners luck because I did a test lure earlier and it was fine. All of the lures had some sort of fish eye where it had run to a thick spot. And there were more bubbles than the very first time. Shoot. Patience will prevail. I've read darn near every form topic on this lol. Still requires some trial and error on my behalf. Question. How thick do you apply? I mixed for two min. The let sit for ten. Then applied. The thicker one seemed to work better. Also appeared like there were more bubbles towards the last bait. So I ended up sanding these down (left the painted one right out, figured id experiment with the unpainted ones first), and re applied epoxy which is on the turner right now. I figured maybe my turning rack was a bit off level? the fish eyes were all on one side. Who knows. I tried one thick, and one thinner. After babysitting them for an hour, bubbles appear ok. I breathed on them every so often to make sure they dissipated. Then leaning in for a closer look, the other one hit my hat. FFFF lol. Lightly brushed it smooth. ***note to self, don't screw around with the baits. Let time do the curing. I also turned up the temp in the shop a bit, maybe the cold weather slowed the curing down alot? Edited March 31, 2016 by eastman03 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 (edited) Etex can be a bit tricky when you first start using it. You have to apply thinner coats than you would with something like D2T or Bob Smith. Etex is designed to be poured on bar tops and such to protect them. Part of that design is that it's required to be self leveling and even out to a consistent thickness over a large area. This is why it "runs" so easily. Thinner coats should keep the Etex from pooling up and sagging, but thinner coats call for multiple coats. I don't build musky baits, but think I've read that a lot of folks use three coats. When I say "thinner" I don't mean thinned with alcohol or some other solvent. I'm speaking of how much is applied to the lure at one time. Good luck and don't give up. You'll get there. Ben Edited March 31, 2016 by RayburnGuy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 (edited) Etex can be recoated easily, because the second coat will bond to the first. I've been successful fixing drips by filing them down even with the rest of the topcoat, hitting them with #400 wet and dry sandpaper to get rid of most of the file marks, wiping the whole bait down with denatured alcohol, and then adding my second coat of Etex. I always did two coats anyway, because it goes on so much thinner than D2T, and it's more flexible once it's cured. Epoxy doesn't like fingerprints, or any kind of oil contamination, so wearing plastic gloves, like the cheap nitril glove you can buy at a pharmacy, and wiping the baits down with denatured alcohol before you coat goes a long way toward eliminating fish eyes (places where the epoxy has pulled away as it cured, leaving a bare spot). I used to mix my Etex in a clear salsa cup from the Mexican takeout near me, heat it with a hair dryer after it's mixed to make it more runny, and then gently roll it around in the cup, so the bubble could get to the surface and burst. Lastly, the reason you get more bubbles on your last bait may be because you have accumulated air in the brush, and it's being pulled out as you apply the epoxy. Try cleaning the brush by wiping it against the edge of the epoxy cup, so all the epoxy with the bubbles is sqeezed back out into the cup. Reheat and remove those bubbles, and then coat the last bait. The Etex should still be spreadable, and the heat will make it more runny again. Edited March 31, 2016 by mark poulson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrogAddict Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 (edited) First off, Mark and Ben give some great advice regarding Etex. I have found that thinner coats are best. I don't see any build up anymore when I apply the top coat if I do 2-3 thin coats. I know Mark uses Solarez or whatever its called but I have all winter to make lures so I'm not in too much of a hurry. I use a small butane torch and swipe it over the lure once it's on the turner a couple of times and that takes care of any bubbles. Just remember to wait a couple minutes after you put it on the turner then swipe it a couple times per side but make sure you just swipe quickly. It's the carbon dioxide or monoxide (I'm no chemist) that pops the bubbles, not the heat. Fish eyes can be eliminated, as Mark said, by cleaning the lure. Even warm soapy water can be effective. Oils from your hands are the enemy for sure. Etex doesn't like sharp edges much so I try to round everything off fairly well and I do make sure I check any radius to make sure the epoxy has covered that area. Etex has a tendency to "move away" from sharp edges and even a tight radius. I keep a 5 gallon bucket filled with water close to my work area to tank test lures. Mark first turned me on to PVC. The reason PVC is so great is that you can tank test it immediately after shaping. I usually pre-drill 3/8 in. holes with a forstner bit and then I fill them with ballast and rubber band or tape them in to tank test. I install all treble hooks but I use some light wire to affix them to the line ties instead of messing with split rings. Once I have the right amount of weight in the right places, I glue the weights in. I use sheet rock mud to fill in the holes. If I have holes I didn't use, I fill them with bits of PVC I have laying around. Finally, I have re-coated Etex after scratching the crude out of the first coat and the lure is still clear and shiny once the second coat is applied. The first time I did it, I didn't believe the scratches would disappear but they did. Hope all this helps! Edited March 31, 2016 by FrogAddict Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 Glad you thought to tell him about using the torch FrogAddict. Not having used Etex for quite some time I forgot about it. Nice catch. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastman03 Posted April 11, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 11, 2016 Appreciate the tips like crazy. Was able to get rid of the fish eye and apply another coat of the etex with some success. I still need to find a better place to do it as the shop was kinda cold, and there was some dust that got into the finish. Good thing for the most part its not the final layer. Still waiting for the stupid ice to melt so I can go and try them out haha. Side note - what kinda wire should I be using in the bait. I got some .051 music wire for my baits. I didn't do much research, but I see this might break down? This is the exact wire I got. Might have to look for some SS wire by the sounds of it. Let me know if this is a huge mistake thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted April 11, 2016 Report Share Posted April 11, 2016 The wire that you used is not a huge mistake, it will get the job done. It must have been a real pain to form. The bigest problem is that it will rust When you are shopping for SS steel, if you get the opportunity, bend the end of the wire, it should not spring back, but take a set. This is the stuff that you want. I thing the spec is SS304, SS316 is the same, only higher grade, for food and surgical applications. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrogAddict Posted April 12, 2016 Report Share Posted April 12, 2016 I get mine from McMasters. It's been a bit since I bought though so I can't remember much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastman03 Posted April 13, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Found some SS304 wire from Fastenall. Should work well. Finally found a creek that was flowing with a few feet of water. The two bigger lures seemed to work quite well! They tracked a bit to the left, but I'm sure I can adjust them and get them to hunt straight. The two flat sided cranks did not run at all. It looks like they need more weight or something. They just flop on their side and float up. This was without hooks on, so before I do anything drastic, i'll put the hardware on and see if they run. Then add weights to the hooks and see if that helps! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastman03 Posted April 14, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 So I gave painting a second try tonight. I really need to be more careful to not bump or touch the bait. Couple spots where i scratched the paint off. Oh well, live and learn. Overall it went well, need to try a different mesh. This one I used for the first two baits has a nice pattern, but is metal, so it also kinda scratches the paint. Cut some stencils out of a sheet of plastic. They worked pretty good, for the gills and the fin. Need to figure out how to make the fin not quite as solid, just one solid colour. Put some blue in there, but that didn't do much lol. Will keep trying, overall I'm very happy with it! Hope the muskies are too. Also recieved some eyes from Lisa and Ed's eyes, and they look awesome! Will add to the overall look for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastman03 Posted November 30, 2016 Author Report Share Posted November 30, 2016 So this is a long overdue update. I haven't really touched any lure building stuff all summer, too busy actually fishing. It was a great season. This last trip out (nov 26), on lake of the woods we trolled the blue lure in the picture above, and another copper/orange one like it, and I caught my FIRST FISH on my own lures!!!!!! It was so cold we didn't even get any pics, just a bit of go pro footage. Three pike from 36-39", lost something else that was probably a muskie. I couldn't be happier, what a cool feeling. Now that we are in the middle of a snow storm, it's time to put the boat away and get out the band saw! lol 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinman13 Posted January 8, 2017 Report Share Posted January 8, 2017 What is ballast? Is it Like lead weight? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrogAddict Posted January 9, 2017 Report Share Posted January 9, 2017 Ballast is the weight. Doesn't necessarily have to be lead though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRammit Posted January 9, 2017 Report Share Posted January 9, 2017 On January 7, 2017 at 7:37 PM, Thinman13 said: What is ballast? Is it Like lead weight? Yes... You should associate "ballast" with the word "balance" Think of a cheap foam cigar bobber from Walmart... It has a lead weight on the bottom to keep it upright... Take away the lead weight and it loses its "balance" and falls over on its side Same with a crank bait Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted January 9, 2017 Report Share Posted January 9, 2017 Here is Merriam-Webster's meaning of ballast as it pertains to our use. A heavy substance placed in such a way as to improve stability and control (as of the draft of a ship or the buoyancy of a balloon or submarine) As Frog Addict mentioned it doesn't necessarily have to be lead. Lead is commonly used because it is cheap and dense. Tungsten is even more dense than lead, but isn't nearly as cheap. The more dense an object is the smaller the physical size is compared to it's weight. When building lures a smaller size to weight ratio can mean you have more choices as to where your ballast is placed. Ballast placement can effect how your lure sits in the water among other things. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrogAddict Posted January 9, 2017 Report Share Posted January 9, 2017 As Ben mentioned, ballast placement is very critical. I had no idea how critical until I spent many hours on a lure with the ballast place incorrectly, it didn't do what I wanted at all!! That's a huge reason why I like building hard baits with PVC. It allows me to tank test before I paint. I love the simplicity that Dieter puts into some of his designs. No ballast except for hooks is far easier to not screw up! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastman03 Posted January 11, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 11, 2017 I was just working on my second run of lures (same as the blue one in the pic), and instead of pouring the lead directly into the lure, I attempted to make a wood block mold, and pour the lead into my mold. That made little cylinders of lead which I could just place into the holes that i drilled into the wood at the same time I epoxied the slot and wire in. So it saved me a step and a lot of screwing around. Hopefully it works out. I really need to get become more meticulous in the small things like prep and taping for easy clean up. Some of those youtubers make it look so easy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrogAddict Posted January 11, 2017 Report Share Posted January 11, 2017 Eastman, Meticulous is the right word. Every time I get in a hurry, I screw up my process! Just last weekend I decided to skip a step making an RTV mold for a new soft plastic idea and I ended up with a ton of small bubbles in the mold!! There went $20 bucks worth of silicone! Ask anyone on here that has built lures for any length of time about their "rejects" and they'll tell you they have a box or something full of them!. I have one that I was really proud of until the last step and I screwed it all up by dropping it. My wife thought I got hurt in the shop that day cuz I was yelling and cursing so much. Don't forget that you don't necessarily have to drill holes to tank test your ballast. You can just attach the lead to the bottom of the lure with a rubber band at first. Finally, congratulations on catching a fish on the lure you created! It's a great feeling isn't it? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
