solder or weld an hook?

[ddl]

guys

is that possible to weld a lil eye at the shank of an hook? looking for something esox proof. looking for the best hook material for something strong

thanks

Edited March 19, 2018 by ddl

[Anglinarcher]

I won't say welding is not possible, but the higher heat of welding normally removes the temper from the hook.  This will leave the hook so soft that it is not hardly a hook anymore.

On the other hand, I once, as a youngster, heated hooks to bend them into a jig hook, then dunked them in oil, to retemper them.

Soooooo, in theory, you could weld the hook and then retemper them.

Again, lots and lots of theory.

[CNC Molds N Stuff]

I think many modern hooks may be a work hardening alloy.  I think this is why certain hooks have press flats on the sides after they were formed. 

To my knowledge, heating and then rapid cooling in oil is known as heat treating and the specific act of dunking in oil is called quenching.  Tempering is when you then reheat to a known temperature  so it is less hard and less brittle.  Much of hook making is steeped in mystery in the tackle business, but in metal working making metals to different degrees of hardness or toughness  (not the same thing) is pretty well documented.  We have been doing it for a couple thousand years. 

I expect if I dedicated a month or two (maybe less) just to working on to it I could learn to make decent quality hooks a couple different ways.  Its just not worth it unless I was bankrolled to go into hook making in a big way.  I expect any custom spring maker could make hooks if they wanted to with little research. 

Getting back to the OP.  Yes Anglinarcher is correct in that heating the hook will likely soften it.  Maybe even to its fully annealed state.  I wouldn't even consider welding one.  You might (maybe) be able to make your "eye" or loop by wrapping some wire around the hook leaving a loop and then carefully soldering it with a suitable flux.  The key is going to be how quickly you can perform the soldering process and how low of a temperature you can solder at.  I don't think I would even consider silver solder temperatures, and I've had mixed luck wetting out lead solder to hooks.  Perhaps if you abrade the hook surface first it might wet out better.  I'd probably start out with a search engine result for "low temperature soldering."

An alternative to solder with no heat might be to use the wrapped wire method described above and then glue it with something like JB-Weld or PC7.  Again, I think you would need to abrade the hook in order to get a decent bond.

Just my opinions of course. 

 

[ddl]

larry dalbergh friend was doing it with something that was like a lazer,i have no idea what it was vid is at youtube i'll try to find it

[Anglinarcher]

I talked to Larry several years ago about that and it was a friend that did it for him.  If I recall, it was a quick release hook he worked on.  I think he showed the hook on one of his HUNT FOR BIG FISH shows.

The Laser welding concept would work, but it is not an inexpensive way.  It focuses the heat in such a small area that the whole hook does not get hot.  So, I guess that Larry proved it could be done.

I have contracted some Laser welding to be done in years past for specialized construction work and I sure could not afford it for myself.  LOL

 

[ddl]

thanks.i think it was that show.it look like it will not be an easy one

[Anglinarcher]

3 hours ago, CNC Molds N Stuff said:

To my knowledge, heating and then rapid cooling in oil is known as heat treating and the specific act of dunking in oil is called quenching.

Yes, I believe you are correct.  I used the wrong term.  

[Anglinarcher]

3 hours ago, CNC Molds N Stuff said:

An alternative to solder with no heat might be to use the wrapped wire method described above and then glue it with something like JB-Weld or PC7

I tried this with a two part epoxy I really liked in the 90's and it worked great, until It got cold.  Then the stuff just got brittle and crumbled.  I never tried JB-Weld and I have never used PC7, but ......... if they hold up to the temperatures, this might be an excellent idea.

I cannot remember the epoxy I used now but I recall it coming in a white box with yellow and red writing on it.  I have not seen it in years.  I used it to make some ice fishing jigs.  They were one fish wonders.  LOL  Always came up with the hook and fish but not the ice blade.

[CNC Molds N Stuff]

21 hours ago, Anglinarcher said:

I tried this with a two part epoxy I really liked in the 90's and it worked great, until It got cold.  Then the stuff just got brittle and crumbled.  I never tried JB-Weld and I have never used PC7, but ......... if they hold up to the temperatures, this might be an excellent idea.

I cannot remember the epoxy I used now but I recall it coming in a white box with yellow and red writing on it.  I have not seen it in years.  I used it to make some ice fishing jigs.  They were one fish wonders.  LOL  Always came up with the hook and fish but not the ice blade.

 

In the 90s you might have even had a decent epoxy.  Not this 1/5 minute crap that seems to be all we can find today at the common sources.  1 & 5 minute has very specific uses, but in my experience are NOT anywhere near as strong as the old school epoxy where you clamped up the part and DID NOT TOUCH IT for 24 hours.  It just occurs to me since you had low temperature failures an epoxy like Flex-Coat might give you a little more range.  Also the hook flexes even at what we consider low temperatures.  A straight glue up probably would not hold up as well as a wrap. 

I am just guessing of course.  LOL. 

[Anglinarcher]

I know that soldering a hook to ice jigs/blades was done.  I use to buy some Mora Swedish Ice jigs for ice fishing in the 80's but the hook was so soft that they did not hold up.

I agree on the epoxy problems.  Just went to ACE Hardware and their wall was covered with 60 second epoxy (seriously?), 2 min, 5 min.  Had to go two two different stores to find the Devcon 2 Ton which is still not as slow as the stuff from the 80s and 90s.

Sure, I agree, we all want fast, but there is a good use for the slower stuff as well.

3 hours ago, CNC Molds N Stuff said:

Also the hook flexes even at what we consider low temperatures.  A straight glue up probably would not hold up as well as a wrap. 

Yep, had not thought of that.