bassmaster0726

China blank manufacturers

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Well I’ve been in touch with a man in China who makes blanks, I am looking to get my own design made and have an X amount of blanks sent to me to paint. We’ve been talking for weeks but Im not able to tell if these blanks will be quality enough to mass produce and sell. I have some LC KO blanks that are great quality and some that are absolute garbage. I don’t want to invest $k’s of dollars and my blanks come back blemished, leak, don’t swim right, or cheaply put together and a cheap plastic. He actually  produces some blanks for some of the big name blank suppliers. The problem is that are thoose blanks the same quality as say a strike king, or the real deal Lucky Craft blanks? If anyone has a contact that turns custom designs into a product please let me know. I would like to know where the big companies have there blanks made and possibly look at trying to go through their manufacturers? Thanks guys  

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Setting up a high production of your own design is a very complex process, and I am not talking about the logistics of finding a reputable company and working out a deal.

The first question is what information does the manufacturer need to produce your lures?

If all he requires is a profile and a sketch, then unless your lure is very similar to another successful swimmer already in production by that company, you may be in trouble, as the lure parameters; wall thickness, ballast location, eye position, and all the rest, might not work out for your particular lure. Basically, you are betting BIG money on a single roll of the dice.

Let us think about this; you have developed a lure that you like. It swims well, good action and the fish like it too. It probably took you several prototypes to get it exactly where you want it. The final prototype is made of wood (let’s just say). It has a particular CoG, density and weight distribution, parameters that you did not necessarily plan, they just happened as you prototyped.

However, apart from the lip shape, profile, tow eye position etc, stuff that was under your control, in order to have the mass production lure swim exactly the same as your prototype, ALL the parameters have to be matched.

You are moving from a solid wood design to a molded hollow plastic design. Unless the engineer at the factory has the skills to take your design and exactly match ALL the parameters, those in your control and those that just happened, then you may be in trouble.

Just like when you prototyped your original, it may take several prototypes to get it perfect with the new design and materials. But, each prototype is going to cost you the price of injection tools. You may be lucky and get something close first time, and I sincerely wish that for you.

With a decent CAD software, you can take your original, and play about with the wall thickness and all the other features of the new mass production  lure, and get it close to your original ‘on paper’. I just doubt that the engineer at the other end of the telephone line is going to go to the 20 – 30 hours of work that it might take.

On top of everything else, you have to take into account that the end user of the lure blank is going to apply paint and a top coat which moves the goal posts yet again. But as long as your painted prototype works then the pre painted parameters is all that has to be matched.

I have done similar work for myself; taking a successful wood design, and converting it to a 2-part hollow molding in resin, playing with all the parameters such as wall thickness and harness housings to match the original density and balance. It was not easy.

I am just trying to make you aware of the problems of moving from one set of materials and design to a completely different set of materials and design.

The best solution is to provide the manufacturer with a CAD model that defines exactly what you desire. Only then can you hold the manufacturer responsible for not hitting your specification, and good luck with that.

No, I am not touting for work. I am retired and do not need the stress and responsibility. My solution to maintain control would be to design a set of molds that can be reproduced, and set up production in-house, then outsource the production with your tools if the numbers are beyond your capability.

I wish you the best of luck. Keep us informed of your experiences.

Dave

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WHY CHINA WHY NOT USA............................................................................

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Salty - It would be much easier to deal with a local plastic injection company, certainly a lot less risk, more accountability. I really don't know why people prefer to deal with China :)

Dave

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I would say USA better in the long run, more quality and control of your product, yes you will pay more but more peace of mind.

Wayne

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Quality is a big factor in cases like this. But China also has a big edge when it comes to an agreement made with the US government in 2011 concerning lower shipping costs for products coming from China. A package can be shipped from China for $5 or less, while the same package going from here to China it around $50.

When it comes to soft plastic fishing lures, like worms or craws, or other creature baits. I can find some in China for say 35 cents each, and find them through a supplier here in the US for nearly the same money. I can order 100 or 200 from China, receive them in 2 or 3 weeks with no shipping cost. I order the same amount from a US supplier and get them in 1 week with a $7 or $8 shipping cost tacked on.

It's not the US suppliers fault he has to charge shipping, he has to do it. The fault comes from the agreement reached in 2011 that gives the supplier in China an unfair advantage over the US supplier.

Quality is a big factor when it comes to having a specific lure made, and quality control here is the US would be easier to monitor. But in the end shipping will be a factor, and here China has an unfair advantage, an advantage we gave them.

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I have been doing this for a really long time.  Currently, most manufacturers of crankbaits are using 3D printers to make prototypes.  They design the lure using a software like or similar to Fusion 360.  Fusion 360 allows you to design a three dimensional lure and output it in the proper format to print one on the 3D printer.  My printer can print ABS models perfectly.  I  can control all aspects of the design and have the flexibility to make any changes I might find necessary to achieve the desired result; buoyancy, wall thickness, ballast chambers, hook hangar location, etc. etc.  Not that many years ago, it would take thousands of dollars to make a prototype.  I can do it now for a couple of dollars in materials and a few hour of design work on the computer.  If you would like to know more, email me.

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BUY USA 

Who cares if it's .35 each. This is why this country is so effed up in trade. Everyone expects cheat stuff. Keep people employed at home. The costs of businesses buying offshore is much more than in USA to the economy. 

/Rant off :) 

 

Shipping is not an excuse to support your own country. Shipping is PEANUTS.

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I could show you lure samples in house that have recently been offered to me WITH HOOKS for .25 each painted . This is outright dumping on our economy. Someday some will wake up to this fact but unfortunately is already to late.

 

Source your blanks in the US please. 

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8 minutes ago, Salty's said:

BUY USA 

Who cares if it's .35 each. This is why this country is so effed up in trade. Everyone expects cheat stuff. Keep people employed at home. The costs of businesses buying offshore is much more than in USA to the economy. 

/Rant off :) 

 

Shipping is not an excuse to support your own country. Shipping is PEANUTS.

 

Shipping isn't peanuts. When shipping is $8.95 for the order,  soft plastics that are 35 cents each turn into 40 cents each. If you're reselling you have to raise the price by 5 cents to cover shipping. Meanwhile someone else bought from China, got free shipping, and is then able to sell for 5 cents less.

If I'm just buying a lure to paint and to use myself, yeah it's not a big deal so just buy here in the US. But in the real world of sales and competition shipping means everything.

As for supporting our country. It was our Federal Government that put us in the situation. If China sellers had to compete fairly with US sellers, we wouldn't have anything to talk about here. If you have a complaint take it to the Federal Government that is putting US business at a distinct disadvantage by letting China ship their goods here for next to nothing by using a program supported by US taxpayers. As a taxpayer you're helping support China's businesses by giving them an unfair advantages over American businesses.

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On ‎1‎/‎27‎/‎2019 at 8:58 AM, R3Solutions said:

I have been doing this for a really long time.  Currently, most manufacturers of crankbaits are using 3D printers to make prototypes.  They design the lure using a software like or similar to Fusion 360.  Fusion 360 allows you to design a three dimensional lure and output it in the proper format to print one on the 3D printer.  My printer can print ABS models perfectly.  I  can control all aspects of the design and have the flexibility to make any changes I might find necessary to achieve the desired result; buoyancy, wall thickness, ballast chambers, hook hangar location, etc. etc.  Not that many years ago, it would take thousands of dollars to make a prototype.  I can do it now for a couple of dollars in materials and a few hour of design work on the computer.  If you would like to know more, email me.

ok, I need some baits made up! I have the bodies in hand and can not find them anywhere. 

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I treat shipping different than most guys, I just don't add it to the lure when I purchase some. To me it comes under expense of the company and at the end of the year I can see what my shipping is and where to save on it. I know it all comes down to profit and loss but if you can, just don't say it cost me $1.00 per lure and I will just charge $3.00 that will cover everything, that's is where you are wrong, I am no CPA but I have been in a printing business  for over 25 yrs. Retired now!  You have to look at the whole picture and bundle up your orders to save on shipping where you can maybe bigger orders which bring down everything and some times free shipping.  

 

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2 hours ago, ravenlures said:

I treat shipping different than most guys, I just don't add it to the lure when I purchase some. To me it comes under expense of the company and at the end of the year I can see what my shipping is and where to save on it. I know it all comes down to profit and loss but if you can, just don't say it cost me $1.00 per lure and I will just charge $3.00 that will cover everything, that's is where you are wrong, I am no CPA but I have been in a printing business  for over 25 yrs. Retired now!  You have to look at the whole picture and bundle up your orders to save on shipping where you can maybe bigger orders which bring down everything and some times free shipping.  

 

But I'm not saying I paid $1 for a lure so I'll charge $3 to cover everything.

I'm saying I bought 20 lures at $1 each and then paid $5 shipping. My lures now cost me $1.25 each.

Or I buy 20 lures at $1 each with no shipping cost, and my lures cost me $1 each.

From here I add in all other expenses, then calculate markup, and set a price. It's at this point I price the lure 25 cents higher to cover the shipping cost. But in doing this I am now 25 cents higher then the person that didn't pay shipping costs, so he gets the business instead of me. Sales is cutthroat no matter what you're selling, I've been in sales for 37 years.

Once people buy from you and like your product, the 25 cents won't mean much. But to get that first sale from someone, that 25 cents can mean everything. 

I guess what I'm saying is we can blame China all we want, but it's not their fault. The Federal government has given them an advantage over US based businesses and they are using that. In 2017 Amazon's net sales was 178 billion dollars, and 1/3 of Amazon sellers are based in China. A large part of those sales come because they can ship here for next to nothing.

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But maybe you don't have to charge .25  maybe its more or less, just to add it on doesn't seem right to me. Good Luck with your business.

Wayne

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3 minutes ago, ravenlures said:

But maybe you don't have to charge .25  maybe its more or less, just to add it on doesn't seem right to me. Good Luck with your business.

Wayne

 

As for adding on the shipping fee, why not it's done on everything. When you buy a box of Cheerios at the grocery store, part of the cost is shipping. Everything that is sold either has shipping built in to the price or has it added on. You calculate the cost of what you're selling, figure out how much you want to mark it up, and the difference is profit. Now you can decide to offer free shipping, and take that expense out of your profit. Or you can offer some other incentive to lower the cost, but whatever you do it comes from the profit, and it's each person's choice how much of their profit they are willing to give up.

The key is you buy your product from China you get free shipping, you buy your product from a US supplier and you pay shipping. The US supplier is at a disadvantage because China's low cost shipping is being supported by taxpayer money.  Our tax dollars are helping China take business from US businesses.

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If there is one thing I've learned about message boards and the interblab. ...there is always someone who knows more than you. Or thinks they do. Good luck with your purchase. When your kids and grandkids can't find a job anymore  you can sit and wonder why. 

Shipping is peanuts. If all you can compete on is price then I suggest you look for something else to do. 

I see plenty of guys with a lathe, drill press and a band saw jump into the wood lure market and sell $30 lures every day.  

 

Make a good product at a fair price and do it legit and people will beat your door down.  Peace n hair grease. I'm out. 

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16 minutes ago, Salty's said:

If there is one thing I've learned about message boards and the interblab. ...there is always someone who knows more than you. Or thinks they do. Good luck with your purchase. When your kids and grandkids can't find a job anymore  you can sit and wonder why. 

Shipping is peanuts. If all you can compete on is price then I suggest you look for something else to do. 

I see plenty of guys with a lathe, drill press and a band saw jump into the wood lure market and sell $30 lures every day.  

 

Make a good product at a fair price and do it legit and people will beat your door down.  Peace n hair grease. I'm out. 

 

And there are all kinds of people willing to see their tax dollars go to help China compete against US, I'm sure China appreciates your help. Then again maybe you didn't realize your tax dollars were helping China, well guess that's where message boards and the interblab come into play.

Your example of a guy with a lathe is a good example, but of course has nothing to do with what I've been talking about concerning China competing fairly with US businesses. Not a lot of little old Chinese guys sitting in their basement with a lathe trying to compete with guys here in the US.

You complained about China, yet it seems you're unwilling to look at the problem. China isn't the problem, our Federal government giving them an unfair advantage is the problem. But hey it's only US businesses that are affected, you know those guys that don't have a lathe in the basement knocking out one or two lures a day in their spare time.

Have a good day.

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