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Fern

Help!!! Why are my tubes tearing open like this?!? so frustrating.

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2 hours ago, Dink Master said:

ok not the colorant?

Hold off on the worm oil for a least a day or two.

What worm oil are you using?

What is your process for mixing and heating your plastisol?

I am using the dead on plastix worm oil. usually apply it right as i put them off to the side to cure. would the worm oil weaken the plastic? 

I use the black bucket tube craw blend from dead on plastix so its already pre-mixed with hardener/softner so I just agitate the gallon for about 2 minutes by shaking it back and forth with my hands. I heat in a 1 cup glass pyrex for a minute at a time till the plastic reaches 350 giving it mixes in between minute to ensure its evenly heated. 

due to the fact that out of 20 only about 15/16 of them are usable with nothing wrong noted with them, I feel like there has got to be something affecting the 4-5 that rip that is the others are not affected by like maybe one of the slots got too much air and formed an air pocket i cant see but upon inspection before putting the jig heads in I don't see anything wrong with them and the plastic feels sturdy. Could it maybe also be that when I clear dip them it is making the plastic thicker and less stretchy? maybe the ones that break are the ones that I am double dipping in clear plastisol? 

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How does the inside diameter of your tube compare what your trying to match? Looking at wall thickness of those tubes it seems to be overkill for the application your doing. I suspect that if you started with a larger diameter mandrel you would have more room on the inside of the tube, a thinner wall, and ergo less stress on the plastic when you insert the jig head. Thats my SWAG. (Scinetific Wild @$$ Guess).

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Try a few without dipping & some with & see what happens. I'd think it unlikely, but you never know especially if you're dipping them pretty quickly after shooting. May even try letting a few sit undipped for a couple days then dip & see what happens. It's definitely worth a shot.

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On 5/20/2020 at 11:28 PM, Fern said:

I am using the dead on plastix worm oil. usually apply it right as i put them off to the side to cure. would the worm oil weaken the plastic? 

I use the black bucket tube craw blend from dead on plastix so its already pre-mixed with hardener/softner so I just agitate the gallon for about 2 minutes by shaking it back and forth with my hands. I heat in a 1 cup glass pyrex for a minute at a time till the plastic reaches 350 giving it mixes in between minute to ensure its evenly heated. 

due to the fact that out of 20 only about 15/16 of them are usable with nothing wrong noted with them, I feel like there has got to be something affecting the 4-5 that rip that is the others are not affected by like maybe one of the slots got too much air and formed an air pocket i cant see but upon inspection before putting the jig heads in I don't see anything wrong with them and the plastic feels sturdy. Could it maybe also be that when I clear dip them it is making the plastic thicker and less stretchy? maybe the ones that break are the ones that I am double dipping in clear plastisol? 

"would the worm oil weaken the plastic? "

I do not know. I always use worm right before I bag my baits. 

I  think more oil would be absorbed into warm uncured plastic making them weaker?

.I don't think you need any oil on them when you  lay them out to cure.

Maybe a expert will chime in?

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On 5/21/2020 at 8:25 AM, McLuvin175 said:

How does the inside diameter of your tube compare what your trying to match? Looking at wall thickness of those tubes it seems to be overkill for the application your doing. I suspect that if you started with a larger diameter mandrel you would have more room on the inside of the tube, a thinner wall, and ergo less stress on the plastic when you insert the jig head. Thats my SWAG. (Scinetific Wild @$$ Guess).

McLuvin has a real good point.... Your wall thickness looks really thick although it could just  be the angle/photo.... there is a balance between too thin and too thick when it comes to stretch.... The one photo you showed with 3 samples makes it seem like the two upper baits have a reasonably "thin" wall - and didn't tear...  and they look great BTW.  Seems like your other baits that tore have a pretty decent wall thickness.  If the wall thickness is too thick and resists stretching - it will find a weak point (thin, bubble, etc) and just tear... if the walls are thinner it should give all the way around and that head has a better chance of sliding in.

I'm sure you can use a "more strechable" plastic - but there is no reason you can't trouble shoot what you have and use what you already bought.  You can use almost anything metal for a core... Personally I'd start there with upping the diameter of the core until you find a sweet spot.

  J.

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Hey Fern,

It looks like the lead head that you are using is pretty big.

Its stressing the plastic.

Shaving it down a bit, or going with a slimmer one should fix the issue.

Moving stuff around  a little, rather than getting too caught up, is often the better option.

 

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18 hours ago, SlowFISH said:

McLuvin has a real good point.... Your wall thickness looks really thick although it could just  be the angle/photo.... there is a balance between too thin and too thick when it comes to stretch.... The one photo you showed with 3 samples makes it seem like the two upper baits have a reasonably "thin" wall - and didn't tear...  and they look great BTW.  Seems like your other baits that tore have a pretty decent wall thickness.  If the wall thickness is too thick and resists stretching - it will find a weak point (thin, bubble, etc) and just tear... if the walls are thinner it should give all the way around and that head has a better chance of sliding in.

I'm sure you can use a "more strechable" plastic - but there is no reason you can't trouble shoot what you have and use what you already bought.  You can use almost anything metal for a core... Personally I'd start there with upping the diameter of the core until you find a sweet spot.

  J.

Yeah, I agree and think the thickness is what might have been causing it, however other tubes from the same batch pour of the same thickness have yet to tear. My mold makes 5 tubes at once and out of those 5, 1 of them will tear open and the others are perfect for use so I guess I just dont understand why the thickness would affect 1 of 5 tubes from the same pour. The thickness comes because I like to dip the tube in clear to seal in the eyes.

although, I have had some tubes that i did not dip in clear that have also split. This doesn't happen to all my tubes, just a 1-2 from each pour which is enough to drive me crazy. lol.

You mentioned I can use anything metal for a core? I am using a mold with rods that were made for it. can I add girth to these rods somehow? I am assuming your comment was intended assuming I hand dipped my tubes so just wanted clarity on if I can somehow add more girth to the rods that came with my mold.

Thanks again for your help, I will def keep trying and If I find out what caused it, I will report back. I have ordered some hard and extra hard plastisol from baitplastics.com so hopefully that helps some too.  

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On 5/21/2020 at 5:25 AM, McLuvin175 said:

How does the inside diameter of your tube compare what your trying to match? Looking at wall thickness of those tubes it seems to be overkill for the application your doing. I suspect that if you started with a larger diameter mandrel you would have more room on the inside of the tube, a thinner wall, and ergo less stress on the plastic when you insert the jig head. Thats my SWAG. (Scinetific Wild @$$ Guess).

I am trying to figure out how to add different color layers without adding too much thickness. Any tips for this? 

I am using a mold and it came with rods i am suppose to use with it. I dont know how to modify it to use thicker rods/mandrel. 

I still need to get a reading of the rods that I am using to answer your first question. Sorry I was not prepared. 

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Have you tried to hand pour one or both of the mold sides before you inject the center?

I pour a lot of my tubes with a orange "bottom" and then inject the watermelon green. I end up with a body that is orange on the "bottom" and green on the top and legs are green.

If you really want to go crazy you can cut the bait in half (lengthwise), put it back in the mold and shoot the top. Since you have to cut your tails it would be easier to do that with the Do-it molds with the spline. 

I leave the bait in the "bottom" of the mold and then use a razor blade to cut across using the flat mold to be my guide to keep it even. . If I want the tails to also be the 2nd color I cut the "top" tails out of the spline.

Make sure the plastic is hot so that it mends with the lower level!

Of course you could use a Dual injector and get the same effect (I know have a Dual Injector so that's how I do it now). Basstackle.com even has a triple injector !

You can make up a much of orange baits. Cut the tail and save then, put them back in the mold and then inject the front color. (The Do-it molds you have to leave them on the spline and use a razor blade to cut above the tail and then pull the head off and re-shoot).

You can also use a dye and paint it on a paint and it will leach down the sides. It looks kind of cool but eventually it can leach all the way down. So you have to use them quickly.

I live in Minnesota so I have all winter to do wild, time consuming baits!

I think the best thing to learn is how to hand pour the bottoms on molds and then inject the rest. I makes really nice looking creature baits!

 

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5 hours ago, Fern said:

Yeah, I agree and think the thickness is what might have been causing it, however other tubes from the same batch pour of the same thickness have yet to tear. My mold makes 5 tubes at once and out of those 5, 1 of them will tear open and the others are perfect for use so I guess I just dont understand why the thickness would affect 1 of 5 tubes from the same pour. The thickness comes because I like to dip the tube in clear to seal in the eyes.

although, I have had some tubes that i did not dip in clear that have also split. This doesn't happen to all my tubes, just a 1-2 from each pour which is enough to drive me crazy. lol.

You mentioned I can use anything metal for a core? I am using a mold with rods that were made for it. can I add girth to these rods somehow? I am assuming your comment was intended assuming I hand dipped my tubes so just wanted clarity on if I can somehow add more girth to the rods that came with my mold.

Thanks again for your help, I will def keep trying and If I find out what caused it, I will report back. I have ordered some hard and extra hard plastisol from baitplastics.com so hopefully that helps some too.  

Is the bait that tears from the same cavity each time?

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4 hours ago, DaBehr said:

Have you tried to hand pour one or both of the mold sides before you inject the center?

I pour a lot of my tubes with a orange "bottom" and then inject the watermelon green. I end up with a body that is orange on the "bottom" and green on the top and legs are green.

If you really want to go crazy you can cut the bait in half (lengthwise), put it back in the mold and shoot the top. Since you have to cut your tails it would be easier to do that with the Do-it molds with the spline. 

I leave the bait in the "bottom" of the mold and then use a razor blade to cut across using the flat mold to be my guide to keep it even. . If I want the tails to also be the 2nd color I cut the "top" tails out of the spline.

Make sure the plastic is hot so that it mends with the lower level!

Of course you could use a Dual injector and get the same effect (I know have a Dual Injector so that's how I do it now). Basstackle.com even has a triple injector !

You can make up a much of orange baits. Cut the tail and save then, put them back in the mold and then inject the front color. (The Do-it molds you have to leave them on the spline and use a razor blade to cut above the tail and then pull the head off and re-shoot).

You can also use a dye and paint it on a paint and it will leach down the sides. It looks kind of cool but eventually it can leach all the way down. So you have to use them quickly.

I live in Minnesota so I have all winter to do wild, time consuming baits!

I think the best thing to learn is how to hand pour the bottoms on molds and then inject the rest. I makes really nice looking creature baits!

 

I have not tried to hand pour my tube mold but I do have a dual injector as well so that is what I typically do. I also have the do it molds tube mold with the two splines but to be honest with you, I didnt care for it too much. I have not tried cutting the tube in half but what I have done is dipped the rod that comes with the mold into some hot plastic in one color and then removed the sleeve that formed and then dip into another color and cut that sleeve in two and placed one of each color back on the rod and then shot the mold with a more transparent color of one of two sleeves so you can see both colors through the main body. Its a pain in the butt but its interesting to do. I attached a picture of one I did with one color strip under neath, just imagine a second brighter color underneath like a chartreuse lime or green. 

I also made a bait where I drizzled some bright color on the side of the mold, closed it up, heated the mold really hot and poure a black over it. It came out looking really nice.  

97995930_180511629934427_7903232002122317824_n.jpg

101291897_255986432129762_290653759908872192_n.jpg

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For the cores - you can really use almost anything metal.  I use all sorts of metal - aluminum, brass, steel.... combinations of the those... doesn't matter and pretty much any metal has a higher meting point that 350.   Basically - just find something metal with a diameter bigger than your current core and shoot a few and see if the problem disappears.  If you find a piece of tubing that you can slide snug over the core you have - that would work too... all you wanna do is see if the diameter is the issue - once you find out if it is (or isnt) - then you can find a more permanent solution.

I will say your tubes do look cool... I love the random mixing of colors.  Nice.

  J.

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