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Flex coat question #1045
14 replies to this topic
Posted 08 September 2003 - 10:04 PM
I put some baits on the rotater last night,after the first coat of flex coat they looked great so...... one is good 2 is better...after the second coat they were probably the finest bait's i've done to date ,so here is my question I went for a third coat got them off the rot. this morn and they went from a a+ to a f, for some reason they clouded up I mix with syringes so I'm pretty sure of my mix, is 3 coats one to many ? Also I live in the Ohio valley so humidty above 80 % is the norm.Did humidty cause this ? also the third coat stayed a little tacky is there a recommended wait between coats ? Thanks guy's
Posted 08 September 2003 - 10:22 PM
Sounds like it might be a mix problem. I have used up to 4 coats with no problems of that sort. Did have a few similar problems using Lite over High Build. I would give them a couple of days to finish curing, then apply a spray on wax/cleaner (simple green or a spray car/boat wax) and buff. That worked on the ones I had trouble with.
Couple of Q's that might also help:
1) Do/did you blow dry the finish to reduce bubbles & improve clarity?
2) Do/did you heat the finish before applying?
3) Are you mixing with non-pourous materials?
Posted 09 September 2003 - 08:09 AM
I have found that if I use Devcon on rainy days that it will cloud. Most of it will clear after a while (a week or two) but it does does kinda hurt your feelings for it to do that after you have put all of that work into it.
Posted 11 September 2003 - 08:32 PM
I would suggest that you scrap the the Flex Coat and use some Devcon. The FC goes on too thin and likes to run here and there. Had you been using Devcon, only one coat would be necessary. From my experience, one coat of Devcon is as thick as 3 of the FC. The Devcon is just as clear, much harder when dry. I can easily leave a fingernail print in the FC, not so with the Devcon.
If your looking for some Flex Coat, I have a gallon I just bought for 80 dollars, will sell for half that.
Posted 11 September 2003 - 09:19 PM
Jed is it High Build? If so shoot me some mail.
Biggest issue with Devcon is long term durability/stability. Have had problems with wrinkling, peeling up to several weeks/months after finishing the baits. Other big problem is that the Devcon does NOT contain a UV stabilizer...this means your beautifully painted, "I spent hours on this one" baits may turn any color from yellow to black when you actually use them (or even just store in the boat). Way not cool. Those problems do not occur with FC.
Won't tell you FC is perfect...just have to get used to the differences. It does take more coats (but it is lighter and more stable). It doesn't fill gaps, cracks, etc as well so it does require a more manicured surface.
***One more Q: How much time did you allow for curing between coats of the FC? I usually allow each individual coat to cure the full 18-24HRS.
Posted 12 September 2003 - 07:51 AM
Dave I thought I would give it a little time to cure before I returned to this post,I waited til the tackiness was gone and recoated the baits this time they came out perfect so i'm thinking maybe I need to wait more in between coats : Also the other question's about blow-drying and heat are both no's,havent so far. I've been using the syringes to measure my mix,the only complaint I have with the flex coat is that it seem's like you need your mix to be perfect with no margin for error. Jed I have used Devcon also and had good luck with it,but it seem's to me that the flex coat has a better look to it( if i put it on right )
Posted 12 September 2003 - 05:47 PM
Blow drying will remove bubbles and "fish eyes", improve the clarity, and make the FC even thinner. This is ok...it helps even out the coat and allows the finish to get into the tight spots.
Think time is the key. You can't rush it. I do sometimes play with the mix a little...to stretch or shoren working time. Heating the finish before applying also makes a tremendous difference.
Posted 15 September 2003 - 11:55 PM
What do you seal your wood with? Also, what type of paint do you use for your white undercoat? One of the the things that I have discovered is that you cannot use lacqer based sanding sealer to seal your lure and then undercoat with water based paint. The sanding sealer causes the undercoat to peel. The lure will paint up just fine.....but as soon as the bait heats up in the sun it will cause the lure to bubble and the paint will peel off just like skinning a rabbit. Devcon will bubble and wrinkle right along with it. I have seen lures that have had slight color changes when fast curing Devcon was used. The quick and hot reaction of the hardener will cause this.
Posted 16 September 2003 - 08:09 AM
I had the same problem as Skeeter stated with the finish bubbling up when the baits were sealed with sanding sealer. I have been sealing my balsa baits with Devcon 30 minute thinned out with MEK. Once dried the bait is primed and painted. I have been using F/C as my top coat for about a year now and have not had one problem with it. I was Cranking rock piles on the Potomac two weeks ago for 3 days Caught a ton of fish Had 12lbs on frist day and 14 lbs the second day. Between the barnacles and rocks I had 2 factory finish baits(1) bomber 6a and (1) Norman Middle N completly chipped up. The baits that I used F/C on had surface scratches and some dingers but were still in fishable condition. I used a group of 8 baits equally for the whole trip. I will say the maybe because the F/C is alot more flexible than the ohter finishes that it held up to the Potomac rock test
Posted 16 September 2003 - 09:17 PM
Here's my take on Devcon vs. Flexcoat.
Regardless of which one I'm using, after mixing I always pour it out onto a square of aluminum foil...to aid in getting rid of bubbles. There is always some unused leftover. Once fully dried, the Devcon is actually quite brittle when attempting to bend it while the Flexcoat stays very pliable.
So.....I figure if wooded baits get banged around on rocks, docks, stumps, etc hard enough the wood will actually deform or dent. Plastic baits generally don't dent...they just crack if hit hard enough.
Wooden baits - go with Flexcoat
Plastic baits - go with Devcon
Probably not gospel, just my rule-of-thumb.
When changing brands or types of paint, undercoat, whatever....better to make a few tests on scrap (wood or plastic). Much better than seeing your hard worked paint job dissolve right before your eyes!
Posted 16 September 2003 - 09:44 PM
Am still experimenting with my sealer for wood baits. Have had the best luck dipping the baits in Kilz primer/undercoat (before hardware & lip attached) then sanding that smooth and giving it a layer of FC. When that cures I shoot on a good thick layer(s) of Createx Pro Flo White and start in on the body colors.
Am currently playing around with Minwax Polycrylic...will probably coat that base sealant with FC before giving it the white base coat. Will let all know how it works out.
btdt...you are pretty much right on, w.r.t. the flexibility of FC. Took one of my balsa baits out of a 3700 and was horrified to see dents and box creases in the finish. Let it hang on a peg hook for a couple of weeks and most of them just sort of "levelled" right out. Pretty neat stuff.
Will not touch epoxy except for use as glue. Have a big sack of baits that changed color, had the finish wrinkle, lost their clarity, etc...
Posted 21 September 2003 - 12:53 PM
For those of you that have had problems with the Devcon changing the lure colors can you tell me how long this took? As an experiment, I have put some of my wooden floats finished with Devcon in the window taking direct sun and have also placed them outside on many days at 90 degrees and have not seen any of them change color in the least. I pulled out some plugs I finished a year ago with Devcon and they look the same as the day they were completed. I'm wondering if some of the color change you are seeeing is a reaction to the paints or primers, is this a possibility?
Posted 21 September 2003 - 05:54 PM
Could be some kind of reaction. Mine were createx primed and painted. Mostly happens with the lighter colors, less obvious with darker craw colors.
Actually happened to my baits while they were in my dry box for a couple of weekends of fishing March 02 at T-Rock. That was the end of Devcon for me.
There is no question it is faster. If I planned on breaking a bunch of baits off, I'd probably use it. Kind of like to get mine back though.
Posted 22 September 2003 - 09:54 PM
I'm wondering if you could scan a couple baits that have changed color with the Devcon and show me what they look like. Have to tell you the comments above about Devcon fading has very much concerned me. I certainly don't want to see some of my work lost a year from now. The FC though goes on so thin that for what I am doing it will require two or three coats which really increases the finish time. This wouldn't be a big deal except for the fact that I am selling the floats and need a timely manner for finishing them. Guess I will keep experimenting some. Thank you again.