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Anyone experienced this weird phenomenon
14 replies to this topic
Posted 12 January 2007 - 01:36 PM
I am just so depressed. I simply cannot get my epoxy coating right. I am making flat sided jerk baits and when I apply the epoxy finish I just totally ruin them, out of 14 produced I have only managed to successfully coat 3 of them, the others I may as well just throw them in the trash cos thats what they are TRASH, beautifully before coating and trash after coating. The problems ??? Well fish eyes and dry patches. I have followed all the advice on this forum about air bubbles ect ect ect. Heres the really weird thing, I have made 4 round profile baits, same wood, same sealer, same paint job and same epoxy and all 4 are perfect and I mean perfect a finish smoother than glass. All lures are beech wood sealed with xylene wood sealer painted with 2K auto acrylics and finished with NHP 'Clear n Simple' epoxy finish dried in a temperature controlled drying cabinet on a rotating jig . I am absolutely convinced that the flat sides are a major factor in the problems I am having.
So if any of you guys are having trouble with perfectly smooth epoxy finishes and need a few fish eyes in some of your lures just send em to me cos I'm a bloody expert just follow the link to see a selection of my perfect fish eyes.
To the TU Admin a request, please get rid of the gallery as every time I look at it I get even more off than I am now.
Right I off for a gallon of beer now
Hail all from Leodis
Posted 12 January 2007 - 02:18 PM
Hey Phil, I am sure you will get lot's of feedback and several different solutions to your problem. What I do, Is use Devcon II. Be sure to mix it well. I apply the Devcon with a Testers brush used for painting models. After I cover the entire bait with epoxy, I pass the bait over a small tea candle. The tea candle burns clean , no smoke. Gently pass the bait back and forth and rotate it as you pass it over the heat ( about 6 - 8 inches over the candle ). This warms the epoxy helping it to cover and flatten out on the bait. If you see a dimple or missed spot, brush it out. I have no proof of this, but I think the bait being heated as well, helps the epoxy cover better. ( Just my opinion ) Good Luck, Joe
Posted 12 January 2007 - 02:25 PM
part of you problems may be oils from your hands on the paint. do not touch your lures after painting and before topcoating. Instead of using those expensive testors brushes I use flux or glue brushes look in the plumbing dept. swish them in acetone after coating your lure and the can be re-used many times.
Posted 12 January 2007 - 02:29 PM
I do just like Joe, but Tally gave me a great tip on using a hair drier on low to smooth out the epoxy, and it takes air bubbles out. It worked really well for me. And I also use Devcon 2 ton epoxy. Good luck in the future
Posted 12 January 2007 - 02:29 PM
Yeah I was gonna say to gently run the heat from a torch over the bait...Also try drying one without the heat cabinet.
Posted 12 January 2007 - 03:39 PM
I'll try to answer all replies so far with this one reply. I do not touch the baits after sealing them and I have ruled out the grease spot by hand theory. I have tried 'Flashing' the epoxy with a gentle propane blowtorch, a hairdryer and over the electric toaster, this seems to liquidise the epoxy and flatten it but within a short period these damn flaws just seem to re_invent themselves, it is almost magical in nature. One thing I have not tried is Devcon 2 ton, luckily it is available in the UK so that will be my next step, I have tried 3 different epoxies so far and now have enough epoxy in my possession to glue a herd of elephants to the ceiling. I have also tried curing at different temperatures in the cabinet including cold and at the manufacturers recommended temperatures plus a few in between, the only effect of curing in an unheated cabinet was it increased the cure time and nothing else. I have even tried a ceramic hair brush, you know the type of thing, round with loads of short individual bristles , really short and stiff which I rolled over the surface of the bait, this I was informed would assist in releasing air trapped in the epoxy, oddly enough I think it almost worked and did reduce the flaws that appeared but reducing is no good I want to eliminate completely:(. I have coated with a few different brushes from stiff to soft but to no avail.
I have a theory though and that is that 2K acrylic auto paints are not suitable for coating with epoxy (after all they are not designed to be coated with epoxy), I believe they must be inherently greasy in nature and this is why I am having trouble. I don't know if anyone here uses the 2 part auto acrylics but I would be interested to know if they do and if they have any trouble with them ???????? I think I may try a polyurethane varnish before the epoxy to see if I can separate the epoxy from the paint (this is how desperate I have got )
Right so its off to the shop for the 2 ton and I'll give that a try followed by the polyurethane, after that, well, I'm gonna give up on epoxy because if I spend any more time on this problem I will never get to fish the damn things and after all that is what I have been making them for .
Thanks for all your replies it is great to know there are folks so willing to offer advice.
Posted 12 January 2007 - 04:18 PM
You may want too pose your question on that paint too KCDANO (he has been posting alot in the thread titled "Question for Skeeter")I've never met anyone who knows about paints like he does.The man is a genious with a airbrush..Nathan
Posted 12 January 2007 - 04:46 PM
Nathan, you are too kind. His baits are even better!
Usually fish-eyes are indicative of some type of contamination, which can come from various sources. The wood might have and contamination that the solvent in the paint can dissolve and float to the top of each coat of paint. Until you topcoat with epoxy and the epoxy can't dissolve the contaminate or stick to that area, thus fish-eye. I would recommend cleaninig the plug before topcoating, with alcohol if it doesn't react with the paint you are using. Sometimes air hoses and the compressor can add contaminate to the line. I would apply some epoxy to a bare blank to see if that is the source of the problem. Could be as simple as the wood contaminated. I you go about this systematically you will find what the problem is.
PM if you need further assistance.
Posted 12 January 2007 - 08:16 PM
You could also try a clear enamel or urethane "scuff" coat before you epoxy. Give it a few days to fully dry and scuff it up with a fine sandpaper, clean with alcohol then epoxy.
Posted 12 January 2007 - 09:09 PM
Request denied, we're keeping it here until you add your photos to it.
Hope you get your clearcoat dilema figured out, I'd try & help, but I have no experience with that brand.
Posted 14 January 2007 - 03:21 AM
Just a thank you for all your replies and suggestions. I have not had opportunity to follow up on them as yet but I will post as to the results after I have tried them.
Posted 14 January 2007 - 04:52 AM
If i was you i'd change to e-tex,it may not cure all your problems at a stroke but it gives a good finish and for the uk builder is a lot more cost effective.you'll find devcon very expensive especially if your making jerkbaits.i had problems with the topcoat at first mainly due to trying to put to much on at once which gave me problems with pooling and bubbles in the coat once i'd realised and went to 2/3 thin coats i found the problems went .if i can help in any way drop us a pm
Posted 14 January 2007 - 07:04 AM
Thanks for that Mark. Where do you get your Etex from ?? I have seen it for sale on Lureparts.NL from whom I have bought before but If I could get it in the UK that would be better.